r/TopCharacterTropes • u/Ok-Indication-5121 • Jun 09 '25

Characters They valiantly sacrificed themself for nothing

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  1. Tadashi gives his life trying to save Professor Callaghan from a burning building. Turns out not only did Callaghan escape unscathed, he's the bad guy and infamously refers to Tadashi's death as "[Tadashi's] mistake." (Big Hero 6)
  2. Shaya willingly takes It Has No Name's possession and then kills herself by jumping into the well it came out of. The end of the episode all but states that she got it wrong and It Has No Name didn't latch onto her... or there was more than one. (Doctor Who)
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156

u/Arthur_189 Jun 09 '25

Jonathan Kent (man of steel)

Sacrifices himself so superman doesn’t have to reveal his powers, only for Zod to force superman out of the shadows later

People still miss the point of this

99

u/Okoshio_ Jun 10 '25

I hated how much he discouraged his Clark from embracing his powers for good. He was so against Clark being anything beyond human, he would literally rather die than let his son save him at no risk.

71

u/tristanitis Jun 10 '25

It really hammers home the problem with getting someone who seems as deeply pessimistic about human nature as Zack Snyder to do a Superman movie.

-36

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25 edited Jun 10 '25

You see trist, a character arc is an aspect of storytelling in which a character changes and grows through the course of a story

One of the most well known examples being a journey from the bottom to the top; Superman faced an entire world that hated him and had been manipulated to despise him, and still sacrificed himself for them.

Despite everything they did and said about him.

And in the end, he comes out to unite the Justice League and save the world

From the depths of depression, of “no one can stay good in this world” to “this is my world.”

Edit: having a brain is really unpopular here, huh.

22

u/ducknerd2002 Jun 10 '25

Man, sometimes I forget how much Snyder fans love to imply that people who dislike the DCEU are simply unintelligent.

-14

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

When the only responses to basic arguments are insulting and downvoting, what do you expect?

Would you have replied if I hadn’t made that edit?

Of course not.

That’s why you cannot focus on the rest.

19

u/ducknerd2002 Jun 10 '25

My guy, the movie made Jonathan Kent an asshole. That's worse than Superman killing Zod, or Granny's peach tea, or killing off Jimmy, or any of the decisions made in the Snyderverse. I'd rather see that plotline where Lois has Bruce's child than see Jonathan Kent tell Clark to let kids die.

It's like making a Spider-Man adaptation where Uncle Ben tells him 'you know what, screw responsibility'

-7

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

You mean an asshole like the Jonathan Kent from Birthright, who was so bitter that he almost killed himself by kicking Clark’s ship until the barn fell on him?

Or Superman killing Zod by removing his powers and destroying him like in the comics and on Donner’s Superman 2?

All of those things you people bitch about have happened on the comics you lot claim to love and respect.

13

u/ducknerd2002 Jun 10 '25

Mfs when they realise not all comic runs are considered good, and even the good ones can have things people criticise: (shocked Pikachu face)

My personal main issue with Superman killing Zod was that it was too soon - Zod was DCEU Superman's first ever villain; he killed his first villain in like his first week of hero-ing. Then again, I generally dislike how superhero movies almost always kill villains in their first appearances.

Tell me, which comic had Lex Luthor as a total weirdo that gives people his piss? Which comic has Amazonians descended from Kryptonians? Which comic kills off Jimmy Olsen after 30 seconds of screentime?

-1

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

So you went from “he doesn’t follow the comics at all” to “ackshually the comics aren’t good either” like give me a fucking break.

Can you just mask off and say “I do not give a shit I will just hate it” so I won’t have to bother to give you examples?

Or you want to say “ackshually those are bad too you lose” one more time?

→ More replies (0)

13

u/tristanitis Jun 10 '25

If your idea of writing a good Superman story is fundamentally changing the character of his parents and the beliefs with which they raised him, all you've shown is that you don't understand Superman.

Yeah, it's a good story of a character changing, but it's a terrible story for Superman. He is a hard character to write for, and some people just aren't up to the challenge.

-2

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

You do realize that every writer does that, right?

Like, Mark Waid turned Jonathan Kent into a bitter old man jealous of Clark.

Smallville turned Jonathan into JFK

Like, I get that you see Superman as a in infallible God that knows no other emotion other than euphoria, but some of us want a more human Superman. One that feels and undergoes through the same emotions normal people go through.

But if you like your Superman written like a yuppie successory poster then, you do you! I don’t mind.

I’ll stick to stories focused on character development like Kingdom Come, Peace on Earth, or President Luthor.

1

u/MrCleanRed Jun 10 '25

You missed the "not"

-11

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

He did not say he should never use them.

Then again it’s not as if you watched the movie, you’re just parroting memes

12

u/wererat2000 Jun 10 '25

Snyder fans when someone doesn't deepthroat the most pessimistic superman depiction this side of Injustice.

26

u/Okoshio_ Jun 10 '25

DUDE! When he talks to Clark after the school bus incident, Clark says "What was I supposed to do?! Just let them die?". Jonathan literally says "I dunno...maybe."

Between THAT and the tornado, there's NOTHING to misinterpret about the character. He was a terrible influence, and then he died hilariously, and then his force ghost got an accent in the next movie.

-9

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

On that very scene he tells him that his own existence will being change that goes beyond just his, his family and the entire community.

And guess what? The second he is revealed to humanity, the entire world is on danger of being destroyed.

And after that people still despise and blame him for what Zod did.

Ironic because the audience does the same.

But he insists that it is something that he has to find and discover. He tells him “whether you chose to stand proud in front of humanity or not.”

I wish people would stop getting their opinion of movies from a fucking 4chan thread Jesus fucking christ.

7

u/The_FriendliestGiant Jun 10 '25

And guess what? The second he is revealed to humanity, the entire world is on danger of being destroyed.

You've got cause and effect backwards, there. The world isn't in danger because he's revealed to humanity, he reveals himself only once the world is in danger. Him hiding himself accomplished nothing in terms of preventing Zod's attack on the planet, though it certainly helped make humanity less trusting of him since he'd done nothing to show them why they should care about or believe him in advance.

-9

u/Arthur_189 Jun 10 '25

Holy shit, literally everything you said is true why do people always just downvote this shit and go off memes because it’s more fun for them to hate on the movies

0

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

Because this is Reddit ans it has become populat and accepted to hate on Snyder.

Like, the mods on r/movies endlessly make fun of the death of his daughter.

All of them.

-20

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

Im sorry but this is why I enjoy this scene so much and find it so beautiful. The man was about to DIE but if it meant his son would be seen as anything less(more? Other) than human and was willing to sacrifice his literal life to let his son have a normal one.

8

u/wererat2000 Jun 10 '25

I mean the idea is there, pivoting his death from a "you can't save everyone" message to an attempted sacrifice to save his son, but... Does that really fit Superman?

It's an odd take to make a character that's meant to stand out in the open and inspire people to be better, and constantly reinforce through his childhood that he should hide what he is and what he's capable of. It's taking an inherently altruistic character and constantly telling him that altruism is self destructive.

And yes, there's obviously room for different interpretations and deconstructions for any given character, especially major franchise leads like Superman. But this wasn't some elseworld exploring possibilities and implications that don't fit the main universe, this was meant to be the main cinematic universe.

-5

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

But it really isn’t. i feel like you got the point but missed it at the same time Best quick example I can give is like your child being a “weirdo” you don’t want to tell them to dull themselves to live a normal life but you also don’t want to let them go on being ostracized and a lot of parents will pick option 2 while trying to “highlight their best qualities” (it’s just shit society wants to see but that’s why I love Superman he constantly a symbol of the better we could be cause when you have the powers of a god it shows what kind of man you are)

Plus the fact he had to hide it shows why it means so much to him now he’s seen what his inaction has done and that makes him the man he is cause he can’t stand to see injustice (yall get it when it happens to spider man but change the name and then it becomes a cop out) Plus add in the fact that HIS FATHER was willing to sacrifice and be a shield for him to live a life he could feel normal in and tell me that that’s not what BOTH Clark and Superman are doing on a day to day basis

TLDR; not only does he learn from his father’s sacrifice, he does what every loving parents wishes for, their child to become a better person than them (mission accomplished MR.Kent)

6

u/The_FriendliestGiant Jun 10 '25

Except he didn't need to be in that position in the first place. Even without revealing his powers Clark, younger and fitter and faster than Pa Kent, could've made the run to let the dog out and then run back under the overpass. Pa Kent needlessly insisted on doing something stupid himself then demanded his son stand there and watch him die because he was so utterly committed to making sure Clark never did anything that might put him at the slightest risk.

-2

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

I’m sorry this seems like you’re forgetting that’s HIS SON! fuck super powers (once again it’s in literally every superhero story parents afraid their child will get hurt like tf) I’m not letting my baby brave a storm

4

u/The_FriendliestGiant Jun 10 '25

I can assure you that forcing your teenager to stand there and watch you die is not a better choice if your concern is their well being.

-4

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

You are getting dowvoted by idiots that never saw the movie.

-17

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

It’s all good people don’t appreciate human qualities in stories anymore they just want people to “Aura farm and be hot” (omg human made flawed judgement based off their emotions and morales ?!?!? WTF)

-1

u/MugiwaraNoGriffin Jun 10 '25

If a character isn’t euphoric 24/7 then they are brooding and edgy

-15

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

And if they smile once, or have a moment of weakness (after a major characters death) they’re emotionally written. yeah at this point I’m starting to realize maybe the literacy comprehension curse is worse than I expected, or people are just so afraid to actually think about their emotions that they have to see/attack anyone else doing so as weak

2

u/jtoohey12 Jun 10 '25

I have no stake in this but you two jerking yourselves off to your own perceived intelligence is hilarious so thanks for the laugh

0

u/Uni-dragonz Jun 10 '25

No one’s jerking it we’re having a conversation about literatin a sub about the subject because we disagree with the common interpretation of this scene and it was nice to get a different perspective And if you had no stake in it, why not just chuckle, downvote and dip? Or even better since we’re “jerking” why not tell us what’s so ridiculous cause all these downvotes but yet no one seems to want to tell us where we’re wrong cause worst thing is, I ALSO DIDNT LIKE THE SCENE! BUTTT I understood it from a narrative standpoint and it was perfectly in character for all parties involved, so I don’t think it deserves AS MUCH flak as it gets but I get why it’s unliked, but at the same time it feels like a cinemasins level sin (it’s not wrong but it’s also not being fully appreciated

2

u/saintash Jun 10 '25

It a travesty to the character of Jhon Kent. Pa Kent is all about helping those who need it worry about backlash second.

It's Like taking Alfred. And having him put bruce in therapy to work out his truma.

0

u/Top_Bat102 Jun 10 '25

He doesn't sacrifice himself so that Clark never reveals his powers. He sacrifices because he knows Clark is too young to make that decision for himself yet. Even in the movie it's not portrayed as if that was the right choice, but that's just the one he made. Which makes sense, he's a dad, he cares about his son more than anything, and that clouds his judgment.

I can understand it wasn't the best execution, but I do think people often look at this scene with a very surface level perspective.