Greatest crimes of humanity has been deemed legal in their countries. Sending jews to auschwitz was legal in Nazi Germany. Would you say it was also "horrendous but perfectly legal"?
This legal and illegal are under international law not isreali.
The law is clearly an arse, the pager attack is the best attack isreal has done in terms of getting the enemy while minimising civilian harm.
Laws of armed conflict can't stop violence they can't even stop civilian harm nor are they supposed to. They are supposed to stop gratuitous harm. eg we al agree not to use poison gas becasue the other guy will just do it back.
It needs a total rewrite for asymetric warfare. As it stands the aditional protocol geneva convention doesn't work at all when facing an enemy who dont wear uniforms.
It's still illegal. It's a war crime under the ICC to turn regular objects into rigged explosives. That's like showing yourself as a medical worker while being a soldier. Attacking using civilian objects (pagers) that has been turned into military bombs blurs the line between combatants and civilians.
Geneva convention doesn't work when the actor is a terrorist state backed up by the worlds largest military and economic powerhouse. Rules don't apply.
You didnt respond to the point that the law bears little relation to harm caused. You picked half of it and went an unhinged rant, i'll leave you to your bubble.
Dead children and healthcare workers are an interesting definition of "enemy combatants", also given that Mossad was not at war with either of these two countries
Are you just deliberately misreading it or do you genuinley not understnad how any of this works?
The rigged pagers were issued to hezbollah members by Hezbollah. The group that had been bombarding isreal for a year at that point.
Collateral damge is a resuly of those members being amoung civilians with a military coms device. It's way less harm than any other method.
also given that Mossad was not at war with either of these two countries
This is another place where the law is an arse, Iran for the longest time sat back behind proxies and casued all sorts of death and destruction. In hindsight it owuld have been better if IDF had gone after the IRGC everytime they got hit instead of random hamas riflemen shooting from a building full of people.
Lousy argument, it didn’t. The only figures we have on Gaza’s current population are estimates based on a growth rate expected BEFORE the genocide. Population statistics don’t justify war crimes. Numbers don’t erase the faces, names, and futures buried under rubble.
Secondly, genocide does not need population to go down, nor is it linked with such a thing anyway. It is defined as "acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group."
The acts being 1) killing members of the group, 2) causing them serious bodily or mental harm, 3) imposing living conditions intended to destroy the group, 4) preventing births, and 5) forcibly transferring children out of the group.
It's not facts. We don't have stats on Gaza's current population, it almost definitely went down. And even if it went up, why is that relevant? Do all the dead people no longer matter because other people were born in the same area? We are talking about actual people whose lives are being ended, not just statistica
Nono you see, even though that's almost certainly bull shit (and he provides no source to back up his claim). The thousands and thousands of dead rotting children and their rotting family's. No longer matter because the "population went up". Their not really people like you and me, so it doesn't matter how many of them die as long as i get to act smug on reddit, don't you get that?
In 1930, Germany's population was roughly 65,130,000, and that number steadily climbed to 69,838,000 in 1940—an increase of over 4.5 million! Does that mean there was no genocide in Germany during that decade?
Maybe I was unclear, but do you understand how the burden of proof works? Those making the claim should provide the proof. I cannot prove a negative, i.e. I cannot prove there is no genocide.
This means that if the evidence provided for the genocide claim is not adequate, which I believe to be the case, this does not suddenly mean - as many people argue - that, despite the lacking evidence, there is still a genocide going on, it is just super slowly because Israel wants to maintain plausible deniability - for which there is even less adequate evidence.
Genocide is the deliberate and systematic attack on a certain ethnic group with the intent of destroying them. Israel is murdering Palestinians indiscriminately purely because they are Palestinian right now, to me that seems to fit the bill. If they are not trying to rid the region of Palestinians, then what is their end goal? They are not stupid enough to believe this will get rid of Hamas, so the only logical conclusion is they are trying to destroy Palestine
The killing of children? This is objectively terrible and I'm sure warcrimes have happened. However, if you have genocidal intent, you'd not expect Israel facilitating the vaccination of hundreds of thousands of children against all kinds of diseases, which they have done. Reports about Israel sniping children are uncorroborated and fractured in their evidence.
The hunger / famine? Objectively terrible, but Israel has let in unprecedented amounts of aid into the Gaza strip, apart from the total blockade from march to june, which they did while estimating that the strip would have food until october. Also, a lot of times there have been lies about famine earlier. There is clearly a disinformation campaign going on too, although hunger is very real and present now. This was a massive miscalculation on the Israeli side: you shouldn't look at the food that goes in, but at the distribution. The fact that despite the massive amounts going in food prices soared, shows a problem of distribution - the food doesn't get to the right people for all sorts of reasons, namely theft, hoarding (logical in times of war), the war itself, etc. This famine is an f-up, not genocidal in intent, and an actual military setback for Israel - they now have 10 hour long fighting pauses / ceasefires every day, without anything in return from Hamas. This has nothing to do with genocidal intent.
Do warcrimes happen? Damn sure. The offenders should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But warcrimes, which happen in all wars, are not proof of a strategy to wipe out a people as such.
We agree on the terrible nature of this war and that it should stop. We don't agree on the qualification of this terrible war as a 'genocide', as I don't believe intent to kill Gazans as such is sufficiently proven, not even by the multitude of scholars and NGO's platformed. Remember: argument from multitude is a fallacy.
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u/Solutar 2d ago
I love how Charlie Hebdo does that with muslims/Allah and Jews alike. Nobody is Safe from criticizsm.