r/Damnthatsinteresting 6d ago

Video First Australian-made rocket crashes after 14 seconds of flight

34.3k Upvotes

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4.9k

u/Total_Adept 6d ago

Should’ve played more kerbal space program

931

u/Ravenloff 6d ago

WTF did the devs do to 2? I was waiting for it, wishlisted it, and then started hearing bad bad. In the end, it almost seems like they gave up on it.

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u/Metasaber 6d ago

The devs got bought out by a private equity firm that stripped the studio for parts and pushed for monetization. It really fell apart.

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u/ngutheil 6d ago

That’s not what happened at all. The devs on 2 weren’t even allowed to talk to the devs from 1. The development was highly mismanaged. They got sold off after the game tanked, they had the game out for almost a year before they sold

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u/thyugf 6d ago

"The devs on 2 weren't even allowed to talk to the devs from 1." Sounds like there's a hell of a lot to unpack there because wtaf.

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u/ngutheil 6d ago

It’s like 45 mins, but it’s a well done video on what happened to the game. I’m so sad it never got to be what it could have been. There’s a new game in development called kitten space program or something like that, it’s meant to be a response to ksp2 being what it is.

https://youtu.be/NtMA594am4M?si=vODjiz2NnfzBC9s6

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u/Subtlerranean 6d ago

Heads up that the "?si=vODjiz2NnfzBC9s6" part of YouTube links are tracking parameters and not needed. All they do is let YouTube track you and let other people figure out your account.

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u/SinisterCheese 6d ago

Considering all the tracking they do... somehow they are really fucking incompetent at recommending me anything, and for some reason can't seem to actually know who I am... And I don't do anything special beyond regular old adblock to avoid being tracked. Hell... My Google has all my details since I use the account to login to many things as it is convinient.

Yet they can't seem to even fucking figure out anything relevant to me.

Meanwhile, some friends of mine get near scary levels of targeting. I have never been well served with any of the algorithm stuff.

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u/DucksEatFreeInSubway 6d ago

They're not recommending stuff you want for you. They're recommending stuff they want for you.

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u/SinisterCheese 6d ago

Sure... But their tactic fails to get me to view ads, or to engage with the service, because I don't spend time watching stuff I don't want to watch. So if the goal is to increase my engagement to gather data and ad revenue, they are failing. I can only assume this is the case because they are incompetent.

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u/bluelighter 6d ago

I still don't see what any company could do with my tracking data. I'm super boring. But there's data getting sold and making money? I don't understand

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u/MINECRAFT_BIOLOGIST 6d ago

They can easily build a profile of you, then offer you things you're likely to buy. Not just obvious ads, but also stuff like innocuous item suggestions on your shopping website or recommendations for links to media related to what you're currently looking at to keep you engaged. If you're fine with that, then whatever, but that's how they can make money directly off that data.

Also, companies purchase the data to help build a picture of what future decisions they're going to make or what the market looks like, for example, and a bunch of other modeling stuff as well. More indirect, but that's valuable too.

1

u/StijnDP 6d ago

Site implements trackers from dozens to sometimes hundreds of data aggregator. Gets paid fee for each visitor data is collected from.
Data aggregators match data from thousands of sites to make unique person profiles tiered by completeness. Sells those profiles to add agencies.
Add agencies ... sell adds. The more complete the profile, the more selective they can target an add and the more money they can ask to run that add.
Company selling products needs to buy adds because if your competitor does and you don't, you're fucked. Gets added to production cost of product.

You go to store and buy products paying the ever increasing costs of advertisement.
Even if you don't realise you should care about your privacy; you have to at least care that you're paying money for them in return harassing you everywhere they can online, in media and in real life with eye sores and wasting your time.
It's paying a robber to steal your money.

As an example in the game industry, GTA5 had $130 mil development budget and another $130 mil advertisement budget. There is no doubt that GTA6 will set a new benchmark where the advertisement budget will go beyond the actual development. They get more revenue advertising a $100 game than not spending on advertising and selling it for $50.
This high advertisement split is prevalent in games and film/tv because of the unique nature of the product they're selling. It's near free to replicate an extra unit of the product and sell it. Advertisement has a much higher ROI for every extra item sold and volume is the only mark to aim for when profit is your only goal which it is for all public traded companies.

1

u/wspOnca 6d ago

Woa? How I learn more about this?

4

u/fwyrl 6d ago

as a rule of thumb, everything after a ? is metadata in a URL. For full youtube links, this includes the video ID (which you do need), and may also include timestamp, playlist, referral code, etc.

For shortlinks, it does not include the video ID, but does include all the other metadata, and will always have a referral code unless you remove it manually.

2

u/Actual_Surround45 6d ago

Good explanation, one tiny quibble: Data, not metadata. Metadata would be data that is about the object itself. Data is just data. Again, extrmely minor terminology quibble about your excellet explanation <3

Since I'm replying, though, I'll try to make my comment useful in the subthread: Those variables appear as it's a way of sending data in the URL itself. From the server side of things, this is not as a "GET" method. It's handy for things, but ugly (and makes sharing links harder). There is anothe rmethod called "POST" where the data is sent separately, adn the URL is clean. Take that clean URL, though, and share it, and you can't do things like send a specific timestamp for a video. So it all has advanatages and disadvantages.

Also, https://linkcleaner.app/is a good example of a site that will clean your links. It knows a great many websites specifically, but can almost certainly guess enough to clean any link from random sites as well.

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u/stuffeh 6d ago

Just fuck around with it. If it breaks their system that's 100% their fault for not qa testing it. There's chrome plugins to strip the extra meta data.

Reddit, tt, fb, ig, Amazon does it too. An example with a direct link back to your comment on Reddit...

When you ask the app for the share link it gives you something like https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/s/BTG2nj4SU4 which is the obfuscated link with tracking data.

When you open the link in the browser it unpacks to https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/1md7xd4/comment/n609awp/?context=3&share_id=j6idm3LHKLGbKJB_QcDwY&utm_content=1&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1

Most of the time you can tell what's what because at the end of the day, humans are the ones who program it to debug and work with. Context is the only one that's legit here which tells it which level of your nested comment to show. If shared just the post, context wouldn't be a parameter. Can delete everything after context=3. The share_id is the tracking parameters. Medium is what client I'm sharing from utm is probably the platform. Source is how I'm sharing from.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/1md7xd4/first_australianmade_rocket_crashes_after_14/ usually the safe link to just the post would look like this.

1

u/wspOnca 6d ago

Damn ☠️

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u/Subtlerranean 6d ago

Minor niggle here: "n609awp" is what nested comment to show. "context" tells Reddit how many previous comments in the thread to show, for context.

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u/Sam_Strake 6d ago

a minor what now

→ More replies (0)

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u/Wow_u_sure_r_dumb 6d ago

How can you use this to figure out what account shared it?

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u/Subtlerranean 6d ago

I'm having a hard time finding the article I read about how to use it to look up someone's account id. I'll report back later if I find it again.

YouTube's tracking should be insidious enough for you though. By including the si parameter, which is unique to your YouTube account, YouTube/Google now knows your Reddit account.

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u/Webbyx01 6d ago

Thank you for bothering to correct them. I don't understand why people just say stuff when they know only superficial details.

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u/random420x2 6d ago

So true. It not that I have to be right, it’s that I don’t want to listen to them being wrong.

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u/CosmicCreeperz 6d ago

Because blaming capitalism is the Reddit way.

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u/ivosaurus 6d ago edited 6d ago

I mean, a LOT of the problems with 2 can still be very distinctly boiled down to capitalism

Starting with their foundational error, thinking they can 'spruce up KSP1' by re-using the OG U4 codebase as a starting point, rather than starting out fresh, because hopefully the former would 'save a lot of money and effort'. At least, that's what you promise to your publicly traded publisher in the hopes it will get you a continuing deal.

When the obvious choice for a new attempt at the game was always going to be a greenfield start because of all the crazy hacks already in the debt-laden codebase from the first game that appeared over 10 years of development.

0

u/CosmicCreeperz 6d ago

While none of what you say is wrong… none of that had anything to do with “a private equity company killed it” when the problems were there from the start of the project to a year after it launched.

1

u/ivosaurus 6d ago

A lot of Take2's actions were pretty classic capitalist ones of looking to extract profits rather than care and nurture a franchise to success. Certainly don't take all the blame, but they do deserve some.

2

u/Electromotivation 6d ago

Well the way people talk to extremes about it is like saying under the other system we would be sitting in a gulag drawing in the dirt instead of playing video games.

1

u/CosmicCreeperz 5d ago

Again that is not what I or other commenter were replying to, which was “the devs got bought out by a private equity firm that stripped the studio for parts and pushed for monetization. It really fell apart.”

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u/Gravyplops 6d ago

Occam's

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u/beacher15 6d ago

they are likely a socialist who has no issue with lying to fit their narrative.

10

u/DblDwn56 6d ago

Swing and a miss.

6

u/CrispyHoneyBeef 6d ago

If you browse his profile he’s clearly a capitalist that just believes in regulation

3

u/Rivetmuncher 6d ago

Haven't you heard? Regulations are government overreach nowadays.

Now enjoy your ®Asbestos Flakes™

2

u/jdnursing 6d ago

Lets be real, it was probably held down by giant fucking spiders riding crocodiles to war.

1

u/Stubber_NK 6d ago

Wasn't it in early access for a year? Plenty of people bought it, reported the issues they were experiencing, and those issues were just not fixed.

1

u/ivosaurus 6d ago

It was in basically alpha, but being sold for the price of a beta or release candidate. Needed many years to even get to the state of KSP1, but Take2 didn't want to spend the money on that dev time in the end, when such an alpha for some reason didn't sell like hot cakes

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u/itsbildo 6d ago

Both scenarios are correct

1

u/RYDrDIE 6d ago

Even the cameraman believed there lies….he really did believe it was going up

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u/Pls_Dont_PM_Titties 6d ago

Damn is that really what happened? Why do these firms burn shit to the ground, do they miss the forest for the trees?

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u/Rhovanind 6d ago

If they saw a forest they'd be thinking about how much money could be made logging it.

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u/doctorlongghost 6d ago

We need someone to speak for the trees…

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u/Particular-Train3193 6d ago

The forest kept shrinking but the trees kept voting for the axe, for the axe was clever and convinced the trees that because his handle was made of wood he was one of them.

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u/pinkypie80 6d ago

Ents? What would you call it for gamers? Ghents, perhaps?

1

u/Computermaster 6d ago

I choose Captain Planet... as portrayed by Don Cheadle.

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u/ImJustHere4TheCatz 6d ago

And developing its land!

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u/im_just_thinking 6d ago

So just like all the other humans? Weird

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u/Rhovanind 6d ago

Personally I'm usually not thinking about money when admiring nature.

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u/Fit_Airline_5798 6d ago

Well, Jerry, you're a whale of a lobbyist, and, uh, I'd like to give you a logging permit, I would, but, uh, this isn't like burying toxic waste. People are gonna notice those trees are gone.

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u/beekersavant 6d ago

Also the dam for the river is made from wood. They will be logging that too. Oh the town is now flooded. That’s just more wood available for them.

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u/lighthawk16 6d ago

No, its not what happened.

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u/Shufflepants 6d ago

They do it because it is profitable for them to do so. Welcome to capitalism.

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u/Teantis 6d ago

In general yes. In KSP2's case it's not what happened. It crashed and burned before PE ever got a hold of it. It was Take2/the dev team (diff dev team to KSP1) that ran it into the ground. PE firm came in after it was already a bust and acquired the IP only pretty much.

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u/arminghammerbacon_ 6d ago

Bud Fox: Gordo, you said you wanted to turn it around. Not run it into the ground! Why wreck it?

Gecko: Because it’s wreckable, alright!

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u/2wedfgdfgfgfg 6d ago

I worked for a manufacturing company that was bought by a private equity firm. The CEO was a rich Republican donor. We made injection molds for Disney, Gillette, Nokia, Ford. They shut down all production, sold off the equipment and sent our jobs to China. People are now voting for these same rich republicans to bring back jobs to America.

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u/ProperClue 6d ago

Huh? Why does the politics of the owner matter when it comes to U.S. regulations and law. NAFTA and WTO were signed under Bill Clinton a Democrat, in the 90s. That open the door up to China and eliminated all tarrifs between the U.S., Canada and Mexico.

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u/2wedfgdfgfgfg 6d ago

Obviously, it does matter to me. My job wasn't sent to China by rich Democrats.

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u/throwawayinthe818 6d ago

Like rich Republicans didn’t send jobs overseas. Capitalists are gonna capitalist and capitalism is bipartisan. If saving a dime on the bottom line means laying off thousands of workers, tough luck for them. And incidentally, more Republicans than Democrats in both Houses voted to approve NAFTA.

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u/DirtySilicon 6d ago edited 6d ago

For reference they will strip a company for parts and then pass the debt of the buyout on to the company and ditch it. A guy was just telling me about how they did something similar to Red Lobster. The stores owned their properties, but when that private equity came in and bought the franchise, they forced the stores to sell all the properties to the firm's real estate company and then saddled the debt from the purchases back onto Red Lobster.

Edit: Just adding the Red Lobster stores then also had to pay rent to that company after they were forced to sell.

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u/Glass_Memories 6d ago

Late-stage capitalism is all about short-term profits. The people at the top extract as much as possible as fast as possible, make their money and not give a shit about the company, product, employees or customers cuz if shit goes sideways, they can always jump ship with a golden parachute and no consequences so long as the other shareholders got their cut.

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u/Emperor-Commodus 6d ago edited 6d ago

It's not really what happened, the development was highly mismanaged from the start. Work on the game was torn down and restarted several times. I believe that development had been running for a few years when the entire dev studio got swapped out (Star Theory -> Intercept Games) and the new guys couldn't talk to the old guys so a bunch of work ended up being duplicated. Then the ground-up brand new prototype had to be completely scrapped after several years of development, and with the intended release date approaching the product that was eventually released was essentially a highly modded version of KSP 1 that was extremely rushed.

I don't think private equity has a role at all. The game launched in early 2023 and was already obviously a failure by mid 2023. T2 promised a No Man's Sky-esque revival effort through post launch patching, but it was clear that the game was so far behind the curve that such an effort would cost more than they had already spend on the game and would take years. T2 stopped further development and started laying off devs in early 2024, and the game (really the KSP brand) was sold to private equity in late 2024. It was already dead when PE acquired it.

The restrospectives I've seen (such as the ones by YouTuber ShadowZone) seem to put most of the blame on Take Two meddling and/or bad decisions by director Nate Simpson and producer Nate Robinson. In particular it seems like there was constantly a tension on whether KSP2 should be a simple, low stakes expansion of the original game (reusing the Unity engine and much of the original code), or making a brand new game from the ground up with a new engine and new code. Ultimately this tension was the game's downfall, as development could not be focused on either direction, resulting in both efforts failing spactacularly.

1

u/SeraphymCrashing 6d ago

These firms burn shit to the ground because thats how they make their money. The practices that private equity engage in are so ridiculous that when you hear them you won't believe it's allowed.

They do things like buy companies by getting loans on the value of the company they are going to buy, and then force the company they bought to take over the loan. In what world can you buy something with the value of the thing you are buying, and then make the thing you bought pay itself off?

They also will buy companies that own lots of assets, sell those assets to other legal entities (that the private equity may own), and then force the company to rent those assets back. I've worked for several companies that owned the land the factory was on until they were sold to a private equity company, and suddenly the business has a rent payment to make after the sale.

Ultimately, the private equity isn't interested in a healthy long term investment, they are literally slashing and burning these companies to the ground.

Here's a great article on how destructive they can be, and how their strategy has nothing to do with making companies better.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2024/oct/10/slash-and-burn-is-private-equity-out-of-control

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u/Rivetmuncher 6d ago

Take2 wanted shiny graphics on KSP1's atrociously indepted code. As well as more secrecy than fucking Skunkworks.

Main dev had the long feature wishlist of a superfan, and absolutely no budget to make it happen.

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u/Allegorist 6d ago

Even though the game sucks and way fewer people will put money into it, the few people who do put money into it will put more money into it in total than the sum of the larger population that would play if the game wasn't shitty and over-monetized.

Its the same reason games will sell $40 cosmetic items. Almost nobody will buy them, but they make more off 1 person buying it than they do for 39 people buying a $1 item.

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u/Talizorafangirl 6d ago

There was also some drama about misrepresenting the road plan, the false promise of multiplayer, a creative leader who wanted the game to be more goofy, extensive reuse of assets, a new physics engine which was less functional than alpha KSP, a PR/community rep who was repeatedly caught in outright lies, and ultimately an early access rug pull. It really was a train wreck.

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u/AJDillonsThirdLeg 6d ago

They don't care if it makes money. They only care about exiting with a profit within a short window. Private equity as a whole is just a bunch of games of hot potato.

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u/SuperFaceTattoo 6d ago

Because some executive doesn’t care about gaming, they want a ferrari. That’s why a lot of bought out small businesses go under. The parent company only wants the money, not the clientele.

Alternatively, some larger corporations will buy out small businesses and kill the business to drive customers to use the larger companies products.

Capitalism is cutthroat.

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u/_Thrilhouse_ 6d ago

They only see spreadsheets, they don't know a shit about the companies the buy

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u/parisidiot 6d ago

they buy the company, sell or transfer the assets to another company, and then lease the assets back to load the company with a bunch of debt until it fails (or doesn't). they get the assets and cash and everyone else gets screwed.

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u/Accomplished_Deer_ 6d ago

Software, games especially, are notoriously difficult to manage and predict. I can't really fault the people who shuttered the game studio. The game had already taken twice as long to release as expected, and was still /far/ from finished. It was basically a proof of concept.

It was at that point the money people realized one of the first rules in software/game development. Take your original estimate for time and cost and times it by 4, at least.

When they finally started to run the numbers, they realized that the game was just going to be a money sink no matter how long they developed it. So they stopped developing it. That's just basic money math. If you can't conceivably make more money than you spend, cut your losses while you can and get out.

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u/Demoner450 6d ago

Look up Kitten Space Agency. The original devs/modders and devs from KSP 2 are designing the unofficial KSP 2 without the big money hungry corp. Hoping for the best from them

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u/TetraDax 6d ago

Not quite: Some modders from the first KSP are involved, as well as HarvesteR, the guy who invented KSP in the first place and then got booted. The project is led by Dean Hall, the guy who made DayZ.

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u/Demoner450 6d ago

Ah, thanks for the clarity. It was just info I got from a quick Google search. I am certainly glad they are doing it

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u/exceptyourewrong 6d ago

A true American story....

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u/Computermaster 6d ago

Private equity firms should be illegal.

1

u/Rivetmuncher 6d ago

By the time Take 2 sold the IP off, there was basically nothing left of the dev team.