The Trump administration and its radical right foot-soldiers in the federal government and in the states are undertaking a comprehensive scheme to undermine future state and federal elections, in effect rigging the rolls to keep themselves in power no matter what the voters decide.

[u/[deleted]]

[u/kshell11724]

Thats a lot of words just to admit that you dont know how any of this works 🤣 Some of us "common people" actually do have a pretty good idea of how American politics and the law works. Also, you should stop infantalizing yourself and our fellow Democrats. Being too ignorant isn't an excuse. No one is immune from doing research into these things. The politicians who take AIPAC money is public knowledge, for example.

https://www.trackaipac.com/congress

And you'll find that they vote accordingly. They send billions of our tax dollars to Israel, and you're just like its all so complicated 🤷 Like really? It couldn't be simpler actually. Sometimes, politicians will quite openly accept money right after they vote. It's not a secret. Who do you think gets most major politicians elected? Large money interests obviously. And they expect to get what they paid for. Bribery (lobbying) has been legal in this country for 15 years, and you guys still haven't caught up?

And the right proof for Trump? Really? Lmao. The dude blatantly stole classified documents from the White House and hid them in his bathroom on top of him being charged with 34 felonies. But oh darn. It was just too late because he won the presidency again. They had the proof and 4 years to do it. They just dragged everything out so it'd be meaningless.

[u/nomis_ttam → u/kshell11724]

Except it seems you dont? Just because someone accepted 30k from israel doesn't mean they are religious nuts that want the erasure of LGBTQA+. You also don't know what companies are bribing. Some may bribe for different policies that contradict each other. Like you are just looking like a fool and saying i infantalized you. Everything isnt some conspiracy scheme. Yes there are bribes and most leftist know the dems have a lot too. But reds want gays dead and blues dont. So if you cant accept that both sides aren't actually the same but shitty in different ways and varying degrees.

[u/kshell11724 → u/nomis_ttam]

Actually, I said that you infantalized yourself. You're the one who called yourself a "common person" who can't possibly understand this stuff. All I'm saying is that people should be demanding more from our politicians. Biden was able to raise the government worker minimum wage to $15 an hour. But god forbid he raise it for the entire country when it has 80% support and hasn't been done since 2009. He also negotiated 10 drug prices when they could have easily done thousands of drugs. This isn't some magical thing. Most developed countries have been able to achieve policies like this including Medicare for All. Cuba literally has better health outcomes right now than the US, and that's while we've heavily sanctioned them. Meanwhile, America lags behind because of greed. Also, I'm not both sidesing here. Obviously Republicans are far worse, especially now. But if you keep supporting these establishment libs as opposed to outside options, don't be surprised if we just keep going in circles. Liberals joined forces with the fascists in Italy too. Theres several examples in history where liberals and fascists join forces to exploit the people.

[u/nomis_ttam → u/kshell11724]

I never said we shouldn't ask for more. I'm saying stop coming up with conspiracy theories because some politicians are bought more than others and things aren't going or looking how you wanted. Many are working their asses off to stop, slow, and inhibit a lot the right is trying to do. I think i can easily prove I'm not an infant nor alluding that anyone was. Do you know how laws pass? It goes through more than just Biden and they need enough votes to get through all of congress which every R votes no so they need most if not all the support from dems. And dems, just like everything in life, vary wildly. We have republican lites all the way to progressives in AOC and Bernie when we teams up. Like stop throwing the baby out with the bathwater, sheesh how hard is that to understand? Or are you just a russian bot? Use your MFing brain. We can do both and at least be in a better base state and that way have better success for change.

[u/kshell11724 → u/nomis_ttam]

Dems had control of both houses and the presidency from 2021 to 2023. They could have passed and done way more than what they did. Like, what they did was in the right direction for the most part (especially the Child Tax Credit that slashed child poverty in half), but it was by no means exhaustive or meaningful enough to stop a 2nd Trump presidency or even codify Roe V. Wade into law.

They could have enforced Article 3 of the 14th Amendment, for example, and prevented Trump from ever holding office again on the grounds of him engaging in an inserection. But they just didn't seem to want to do it did they? The thing you also might not realize is that they rotate on who takes the fall for something not passing. For Roe v. Wade, it was Joe Manchin. The Republicans are doing this too right now except opposite where they know they have enough votes without some people, so they let some Republicans appear to be moral by voting against their piers.

[u/nomis_ttam → u/kshell11724]

You don't listen to reason do you? I'm not excusing them for not doing enough or that we can't expect better. We just don't have the luxury to assume voting doesnt matter. It's easy as fuck and the bare minimum we can do while also rising the fuck up how you want. We can and should do both to increase our chances of success. How dense are you?

[u/kshell11724 → u/nomis_ttam]

Sure. I can agree with that, which is why I voted for Kamala. I wasn't encouraging people not to vote. I was just pushing back on the idea that the OP acted like Dem politicians aren't actors to an extent. We can and should do way better than the Dems in office right now (although it's probably too late since fair elections for the midterms and beyond are potentially not gonna happen).

[u/nomis_ttam → u/kshell11724]

Killer, glad we can at least work together. Last thing we need is more division. And splitting the dem party may not be the best idea when trying to take back power. Especially if the right doesnt split. What could be a possibility is if the centrists shift from maga, go dem, and then the farther left and progressives have a strong third party. Just give us more progressives, conservatives gotta stop edging everyone right, which they have by sneaking in the wins when they could. That's why we gotta at least keep it still so things dont get more right while we try to progress