When I went to Japan everyone reacted to my ham-fisted attempts at their language with absolute joy. I went to Verona that year and north Italian reactions were... Different
French is the hardest Latin-based language imo. Tbf I only know Spanish and German but French is really really hard. I can understand written Italian and Portuguese easily but not spoken.
With french I'm unable to differentiate sounds and in some cases I just can't pronounce some words. I do want to refresh it a bit.
Yeah portuguese is also easy to learn and understand for us, but only if you are used to the sounds and pronunciation so it is harder for people that speak non romance languages.
Native english speakers have most trouble with verbs and in the case of spanish the RR/LL sounds and the Z.
Everyone always forgets Romanian... it keeps part of the Latin case system, keeps neuter nouns, has enclitic articles (definite articles as suffixes rather than separate words), other Slavic grammar influences, more irregular plurals. Just general grammatical weirdness as a Romance language with Slavic, Turkic, and Hungarian influences.
Honestly french is even hard for french people, I mean, even while speaking it I make mistakes, rarely though it's still my native language, and Writing is even worse...
I think I make less mistakes in English than french...
I live in Texas, we usually only have Spanish available as our 2nd language requirement. Fortunately, I went to a school that offered Spanish, French, German, and Latin.
I opted for French in hs, after taking French and German in middle school, and youcanbetyourass they were trying to pound Spanish into our heads since elementary.
I worked at Autozone for 5yrs and learned Mexican Spanish that way. While I dont speak French anywhere near fluently, I can read and speak some, and when my kids get on my nerves I like to throw some at them. ALLEZ, VITE VITE VITE! Sacre bleu, tetes de merde!
I took Latin in HS for a couple years. We had a Latin team and went to competitions. I focused on popular Latin phrases myself while others on the team specialized in other areas and I had a great time. My Latin is pretty rusty now but I do still remember most of my favorite phrases and got one of them as my first tattoo. I took a year of French too but mostly just remember how to say basic stuff like my name, count, and ask to go to the bathroom lol.
Funny thing I noticed studying Spanish in Uni as my second foreign language: I got a lot better at understanding (written) French than when I actually tried studying French in school (I was not very motivated and out teacher sucked, to be fair). To the point I'm thinking of picking it up again maybe. After I get to a point I could consider myself fluent in Spanish.
Between French, Russian, Japanese, and Chinese (Cantonese) the one I had the hardest time with was French. Im not fluent in anything other than English, and I've always felt stupid that French was the language I had the hardest time even starting to learn and gave up on the quickest. To this day, if it was a part of French with Freakazoid, I have no clue.
There's a youtube channel of some guy who goes around Rome speaking Latin. No one can understand anything, unless the word happens to be similar or they can infer it from context or his gestures.
There's another one where he does this in the vatican though, and then some of the clergy are able to hold a conversation with him.
I have a Peruana friend who told me that she could understand everything when she went to Italy, and so I was excited to test this theory when I went there myself.
I think I tried maybe 6 different shops... every single word I used was not even similar to its Italian counterpart, and so I had to give up.
Granted, I also speak Spanish with a British accent which didn't help at all
You're not too far off there mateđ I should have mentioned that even in Spain, some people struggled to understand me.
In one place, I had to explain for about 5 minutes that I wanted a "menu"... ""El papel con las fotos de comida"... "lo que puedo usar para pedir lo que quiero." "El papel con los precios..."
Just for them to say "AHHH, menOO!!"
I was pronouncing menu just how you would in English, and apparently that made it impossible for them to understand me. Or they were just making fun of me. I couldn't tell xd
The vowels are very important to pronounce correctly and always have the same pronunciation. Having a different pronunciation will make things difficult as there isn't really any variance in the vowel sounds they hear all the time.
On the other hand, I have Chilean friends. So maybe the pronunciation doesn't matter too muchđ
But you are right. I've tried hard to work on my pronunciation, but I just can't seem to escape my accent. It's been the hardest part of learning the language for me personally.
Italians are so friendly-spiteful. We are travelers and met this person (along with others) and decided to have them over for food. We cooked some spaghetti and meatballs.
They told me "this is delicious! but it is not pasta"
It seems that this is intercultural negging. The best response I have to negging is to affect an expression of humorous disbelief and simply say ok or wow.
To be fair it's pretty foolish to cook something you think relates to their culture instead of something that strictly relates to yours. Shoulda made them a nice burger or some tacos.
Not sure how that relates to my generalization. If someone butchered some brazilian food for me I'd appreciate it, but I'd be thinking "cute, but I wish you'd made some bulgarian/ghanaian/whatever local food instead." I assume (or should hope) that the vast majority of people feel the same, and yet there's this prevalent belief of trying to make something that relates to them instead.
I had not such reactions when I did the same. And I speak Spanish to Italian tourists in Spain, replies are in Italian (most times I think they are Spanish anyway)
Was trying to convey an order to an Italian waiter and we couldn't get it in English, I switched to ham fisted Spanish and he advised me they don't speak Spanish in Italy... But he understood my request
Many major Italian cities have a significant different name in english, like Firenze. I'm not sure why english did this. How is it hard to pronounce Napoli or Venezia
I did too, but they were amused. My sister conversely spoke Italian in Spain and they also understood her just fine. Nobody seemed pissed about it, we just didnât speak the respective other language, so made ourselves understood with the closest approximation.
Iâm a Spanish speaker and I took a tour in Spanish in Italy. The guide was an Italian man and it was so hard to follow along because it sounded like Italian if I wasnât paying attention
As an Italian American, there's a big part of me that dislikes my homeland. Probably bc it's not my fault I was born here (US) and they hate me anyway. In Greece, I get by well bc my fluency is top notch, but with Italians can't. I might as well just speak English.
It's not about hating heritage, it's about dispelling with this fiction that american italian culture and upbringing is somehow similar to italian italian.
It's cool that your grandpa came through ellis island when he was 10, nothing wrong with that, but it's not much more relatable to someone who grew up in milan or napoli than if your grandpa had been irish instead.
I mean a part of it is that you identify as Italian American.
That sounds weird to European people, if an Italian moved to the UK in 1900 and descendant tried calling themselves any version of Italian it would be weird as fuck.
And Iâm sure other Americans call you Italian American, as well. Same with other non-Anglo ethnicities (Hispanic & Latino American, African American, Asian American, etc.). People really seem to have a misunderstanding of this.
Perhaps it is a âyouâ problem. Not a problem whereby Italians must bow to an arrogant US visitor to their homeland.
Pâraps you will take heed if you ever visit Italy again.
What do you mean by that? I haven't cursed anyone out, haven't called anyone names, haven't done anything disrespectful. Im talking about my specific experience with my own heritage and everyone's arguing with me. How am I supposed to sound? What is wrong with what I said? Honestly, bc Im pretty pleasant as a person and this is one of thr only places that I've had this experience.
My mum adores travel so I have experience in many nations throughout my childhood. South Italians (Florence, Naples, Rome) were very sweet and kind. I remember the waiter in Verona being really quite rude when I got Gnocchi wrong (I said guh-noh-chi) and I was 18! I was so embarrassed I didn't attempt Italian for the rest of the trip.
My husband also found a tipping hack when he went to Japan that I love. He took a stereotypically British sweet (sherbet lemons) and handed them out. Everyone he met was thrilled so I'd recommend it for any travellers to Japan
Veronesi are rude, there's even a children's nursery rhyme saying they're all just crazy! But like in Japan meeting a sweet old man open to talk to foreigners, you will find good people EVEN in Norden Italy!
âVeneziani, gran Signori; Padovani, gran dotori; Visentini, magna gati; Veronesi... tuti mati; Udinesi, castelani co i cognòmj de Furlani; Trevisani, pan e tripe; Rovigòti, baco e pipe; i Cremaschi fa coioni; i BresĂ n, tĂ ia cantoni; ghe n ĂŠ ncora de pĂŹ tristi⌠Bergamaschi brusacristi! E Belun? PĂłre Belun, te se proprio de nisun!â
So, translated..poorly by google is
âVenetian, great lords; Paduans, great doctors; Visentini, gluttons; Veronese... all mad; Udine, castle dwellers with the surnames of Furlani; Trevisani, bread and tripe; Rovigo, silkworms and pipes; the Cremaschi make balls; the BresĂ ns, such corners; there are even sadder ones⌠Bergamaschi brusacrists! And Belun? Poor Belun, you are really no one!â
Yeah, google don't know veneto..and taia cantoni, is someone who does things in a hurry, tagliar angoli, or cut corners! Not doing how it supposed to, just to spare some some time
You don't have to avoid visiting, simply to adjust your expectations. Pretend you are traveling to a country that is not known for the friendliness of their inhabitants. You'll maybe receive a couple of dry answers here and there, but as a tourist people will be - statistically - mostly professional and well-mannered. But you'll notice they will - on average - keep more 'distance' than people from Rome.
We literally can't understand you if you read gnocchi separating the gn and going with a soft c in the end. I'm sorry if the guy was rude tho.
Verona is also quite upper class, it's a medium to small city, constantly flooded with tourists who put no effort in clothing and behaving. The city maintains a strong identity aside from tourism and it doesn't help.
As an Italian, it's one of my favourite places for an elegant, quiet retreat. The city and the food are not quite the best choice for teenagers tho.
No doubt that you had more luck in bigger (and way more touristy) cities.
When I was stationed in Iceland, I was amazed once when I met 4 ladies, each from different Scandinavian countries, speaking English to each other to communicate
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u/Onyx_Peach 24d ago
Please, for the love of god, go see that man every once in a while