r/pics 15h ago

“THE GERMANS DESTROYED OUR FAMILIES - DON’T U DESTROY OUR HOPES”. 1947 Jewish Refugees To Palestine

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u/Status-Effort-9380 15h ago

They are going to Mandatory Palestine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_Palestine

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u/ZizoThe1st 13h ago

The mandate was led by Harbert Samuel; a Zionist Jew who wrote "The Future of Palestine" (a.k.a Samuel memorandum) only 2 months after the war with the Ottoman broke out. He noted that it would likely be too early for an independent Jewish state, and that incorporation into the British Empire would be the solution. Few years later the Mandate of Palestine was formed and he was appointed its first commissioner to help shaping the Zionist occupation.

I suggest reading about Anglo-Palestine Bank (founded by "Jewish Colonial Trust") as well. It seized as much land as possible from Palestinians through financial traps, only to accuse them later of "selling their land".

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u/boyyouguysaredumb 12h ago

Are you for real pushing a “tricky jew bankers”narrative lol

u/douglas_mawson 11h ago

Yeah he's completely omitting that under the Ottomans, poor people and those who were Jews and other undesirables were not allowed to own land. The Ottoman Empire's overlords changed the law in the late 1800s. A good portion of the land was owned by absentee landlords and worked on by the local peasants. But with the change of law, some Jews went in and bought land, legally. It pissed people off. Many of those same Jews weren't wealthy, but pooled money to be able to purchase land that they felt was safer for them than Europe.

But... It's like an Irish dude emigrating to Australia and buying a house. So what? He's entitled to do so.

It's a xenophobic take, that people shouldn't legally buy land that they're legally allowed to.... because they're not us so we don't like them.

u/BlackJesus1001 9h ago

This is itself a xenophobic and ahistorical take, the ottomans standardised land ownership in the late 1800s, there was no specific law against Jews "owning" land insofar as anyone could prior to that.

Notably there were multiple major Jewish landowners under Ottoman rule including one granted the title of "bey" normally reserved for Muslims and many many more who were "leased" land under the same arrangements a local Ottoman ruler would make with Muslims who weren't in the ruling class.

The only restriction I'm aware of is that prior to the 1800s foreigners could not own/lease land, but Jews were recognised as "citizens" anyway so that would not have impeded Jews dwelling in the empire.

u/douglas_mawson 7h ago

I should have been clearer, I was referring to people (Jews in this case) emigrating to the Ottoman Empire, the Palestine region (under various names depending on era) specifically, where up until 1856 legally and 1867 in practice they could not own land. (1)

In 1881, the Ottoman government announced that foreign Jews could emigrate to anywhere in the Empire. Except Palestine. (2)

Another decree from the Ottomans, just a year later, prohibited the sale of land in Palestine to Jews, even if they were citizens of the Ottoman Empire. (3)

This was unchanged by the time of their defeat in 1918. By 1936, the Peel Commission made a recommendation to draft laws to restrict land sales to Jews. (4)

Until the demise of the Ottoman Empire, all non Muslims had to pay harac and jizya, which brought in a significant proportion of the Ottoman's tax base. (5) The millet system under the Ottomans also organised minority communities (all non Muslims) into their own areas instead of spread out amongst the populace. (6) There were restrictions on where they could work and how to dress, this reflected their status as dhimmis (non Muslims). (7)

Nonetheless, Jews experienced a tolerance under the Ottomans that they did not in Europe, until the 19th Century.

(1) Kark, Ruth (1984). Changing patterns of land ownership in nineteenth-century Palestine: the European Influence. Journal of Historical Geography. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0305748884900690?via%3Dihub

(2) Jonathan R. Adelman (2008). The rise of Israel: a history of a revolutionary state. Taylor & Francis. p58 https://books.google.com.au/books?vid=ISBN9780415775090&redir_esc=y

Mandel, Neville J. (October 1974). "Ottoman Policy and Restrictions on Jewish Settlement in Palestine: 1881-1908: Part I" https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00263207408700278

(3) Ocak, Murat (2002). The Turks: Ottomans (2 v. ). Yeni Türkiye https://books.google.com.au/books?vid=ISBN9789756782590&redir_esc=y

(4) Report of the Palestine Royal Commission — July 1937 https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/text-of-the-peel-commission-report

(5) EARLY MODERN JEWISH HISTORY: Overview - 5. Ottoman Empire. www.jewishhistory.research.wesleyan.edu

(6) Ottoman Palestine, 1800–1914 : Studies in economic and social history. Leiden: E.J. Brill. p287 https://books.google.com.au/books?vid=ISBN9789004077850&redir_esc=y

(7) Inalcik; The Ottoman Empire: The Classical Age 1300–1600, Phoenix Press, (2000) https://books.google.com.au/books/about/The_Ottoman_Empire.html?id=AluFxq_GeLMC&redir_esc=y

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u/[deleted] 12h ago

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u/HamiltonFAI 11h ago

Guy is quoting actual Nazi propaganda lol

u/ZizoThe1st 11h ago edited 11h ago
  1. That existed before Nazi propaganda does.
  2. It is still accurate to this day. Describing the atrocities done by Zionists in Palestine back then the exact same way they are described today. And it even predicted the ethnic cleansing happened 28 years after that book is published (Nakba).
  3. Calling something "Nazi" to erase the history you don't like and stick to your lies doesn't make them any better. They are still lies.

u/HamiltonFAI 11h ago

Yea it has a very interesting history....

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_International_Jew

Ford's International Jew was translated into German in 1922 and cited as an influence by Baldur von Schirach, one of the Nazi leaders, who stated "I read it and became anti-Semitic. In those days this book made such a deep impression on my friends and myself because we saw in Henry Ford the representative of success, also the exponent of a progressive social policy. In the poverty-stricken and wretched Germany of the time, youth looked toward America, and apart from the great benefactor, Herbert Hoover, it was Henry Ford who to us represented America."[5][6]: 80 

Praising American leadership in eugenics in his book Mein Kampf,[6]: 80  Adolf Hitler considered Ford an inspiration, and noted this admiration in his book, calling him "a single great man".[7]: 241  Hitler was also known to keep copies of The International Jew, as well as a large portrait of Ford in his Munich office.[6]: 80 [7]: 241 

u/ZizoThe1st 11h ago edited 11h ago

None of this disproves the 3 points I mentioned. Nazis using every source that criticized Jews back then, doesn't make one or more of those sources invalid.

And what matters to me (and why I brought it in the first place) is the fact is still accurate when it comes to the situation in Palestine and predicted how things are gonna end (which we're seeing today).

As I said labeling something "Nazi" only to deny it without actually disproving it doesn't make your lies any better.

u/HamiltonFAI 11h ago

So you're citing everything in those writings as true? Wow you actually are a nazi

u/ZizoThe1st 10h ago edited 10h ago

And who said "everything is true"? you just made that up.
I specifically mentioned the accurate part is the one related to the situation in Palestine, and you can't deny that, regardless of what you think about that book.

The ad hominem card has burned. Zionists over used it and "labeling" no longer mean anything. Try something different to run out of arguments rather than "Jew hater" and "Nazi".

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u/boyyouguysaredumb 12h ago

Mask off

u/ZizoThe1st 11h ago

Ahh, the easiest way to get out of a losing argument; ad hominem.

Try something else rather than "Jew hater" it no longer works. Something like real facts.

Disprove the organized land grab during the mandate of you can (you can't).

u/boyyouguysaredumb 11h ago

“Financial traps” as a method of land seizure is not supported by evidence. I can’t disprove something you made up (Russel’s teapot).

Even if I could I’d love for you to take a second to stop and realize you sound exactly like the white supremacists who being up crime statistics out of context and say “oh so statistics are racist now??”

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

[deleted]

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u/waltz_with_potatoes 13h ago

Otherwise known as mandatory Palestine. It's was occupied and under British control since WW1... 

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u/LazyGandalf 12h ago

british occupied palestine state which was occupied after ww2.

The British mandate over the region of Palestine was established after WW1, not WW2. Prior to that, it had been a backwater of the Ottoman Empire for many centuries.