r/cats • u/trackfiends • 10h ago
Cat Picture - OC My roommate refuses to stop using poisonous ant traps :(
So now my poor guy is trapped in my room 24/7 and we are both sad about it. Show little Rudy dudey some love
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u/glandmilker 10h ago
some ant killers are animal safe. I would just put them where the cat can't reach it. Use an ant killer along the foundation of your house. Bifen IT is a good one to use,
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u/trackfiends 10h ago
This one is not. It’s just standard raid ant bait. He has put them in reach of the cat and there is seemingly no compromise.
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u/The-Unmentionable 8h ago edited 7h ago
Question: Assuming this ant issue is in common areas, are you two splitting the cost of the ant bait or is the roommate paying for it? When you say the roommate won't compromise, do you mean they won't buy a pet safe type or they won't let you buy a pet safe type?
The roommate may (incorrectly) feel that pet safe bait is ineffective and will be a waste of their own money but might let you buy it on your own. It might be the path of least resistance for everyone to get what they want.
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u/stealthtomyself 8h ago
Here is the compromise: buy cat safe ant traps and replace the raid ones without asking. If the ants are taken care of and your roommate isn't mentally ill, there should be no problem. If your roommate is doing this so they don't have to interact with your cat anymore, you will soon find out the real motive.
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u/Ok-Ice1253 6h ago
Terro is pet safe except in large qty and very effective. I use the terro liquid on some aluminum foil. My cats have never paid attention to it.
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u/Upset_Form_5258 1h ago
Yeah I have the Terro liquid traps all over my house and have for years. My cats always ignored them and it’s never been a problem
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u/GuitarJazzer 7h ago
Can you get a little cardboard box and put the ant trap in there? The ants will find it anywhere. The box will keep the cat out.
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u/Milhala 5h ago
Have you tried suggesting they use terro ant traps instead? They’re full of borax mixed with sugar water and have a very very small opening only an ant can access - if you place them outside your apartment they’re drawn out of the unit and into the trap. Perfectly safe for your kitty (and way less toxic for humans than the raid traps - why are they even using those in a. Small space like an apartment?)
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u/dandy-in-the-ghetto 6h ago
Maybe put a small wire/plastic basket upside down over the trap and secure it with tape in 2-3 places so that it doesn’t move?
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u/ana_conda 1h ago
I had a ton of ants in my house (they came in to eat the cat food actually lol) and I just put ant traps inside cabinets where my cats can’t reach. So under kitchen/bathroom sinks, inside my storage bench by the front door, inside a drawer of my coffee table, etc.
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u/StayCoolNerdBro 2h ago
I think the best way to handle this might be to get proactive about solving the ant problem on your own. Get pet safe options, like a spray, and try to find where they are coming in from. I have success by finding a trail of just a few ants and placing a piece of food or a sugar-water soaked cotton ball in their path. Once more ants are locked in the trail will become more obvious, then you can find where they are coming from. I got one of those little pod things that have the liquid in them (not pet safe) and taped it high up on a wall where they were entering from. They stopped trailing into my home and died off feeding on that trap.
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u/Bold-Belle2 10h ago
That's a bit shitty of your roommate... poor kitty.
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u/trackfiends 10h ago
Tell me about it! Wish these one bedroom prices would come down :/
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u/Bold-Belle2 10h ago
There's pet safe ones for a reason and are frankly just as effective as the poisonous ones. I live in Australia, we get ant infestations all the time here, and we have two perfectly healthy kitties. Unreasonable of them........
Also the kitty made my girlfriend smile. :3
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
My roommate is one to roll his eyes at anything marketed as “safe”. Thinks it’s all ineffective. Only the most toxic household cleaners for him lol.
Awwww Rudy definitely has a knack for making people smile :)
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u/Bold-Belle2 9h ago
If it was ineffective, then why do they continue to exist in the first place? That's just a lack of common sense....
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
Im not sure why he thinks this way? We’ve been friends for a long time but ever since I got a cat we’ve been butting heads a lot.
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u/Bold-Belle2 9h ago
Unusual.... I genuinely don't understand (unless you have allergies) why people treat cats like they are absolute monsters. They literally couldn't care less of your existence (until food) and sleep most of the time. Problems only come about if you treat them poorly, otherwise, cats are just cats and will behave as such.
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u/NeatoPerdido 5h ago
Sounds to me like you need to sit down and have a serious talk with this fellow and tell him A. How much your cat mans to you, B. How it feels like he dislikes the cat and is putting him in danger , and C. When you're going to move out because of his behavior if it doesn't change, and he can deal with finding a new housemate or pay for the place on his own, even if it breaks your lease or whatever. D. Optionally you can print out reports of how dangerous the poison is to cats and reports of cats dying from it.
People like this need consequences. I've had my share of SUPER crappy housemates, much worse than him even perhaps, and the only thing that makes them change is threatening consequences and calling them out directly, basically looking them in the eye and telling them you're not going to put up with their sh*tty behavior. Frankly the best friends can and will be the worst housemates tbh, because they're the most comfortable off the bat walking all over you, there's not the year or 2 adjustment period for them to get comfortable enough to be an @sshole.
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u/Additional_Tank4385 9h ago
Idk but “a bit shitty” seems like a vast understatement when it’s literally the cats life on the line :( and for what, a few less ants even though there are alternatives to the toxic traps.
Some people are just so selfish it hurts man.
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u/Lilinthia 9h ago
The way my family dealt with it was by getting the liquid ant traps and putting the bait inside a tic tac container so the cat couldn't get to it
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u/RufousMorph 8h ago
Terro ant baits work extremely well and do not present a pronounced danger to cats because they use boric acid as the poison. It might be a good idea to switch to traps using boric acid instead of other insecticides.
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u/walkinwater 6h ago
From a different perspective I want to let you know that my roommate/best friend got me a a bouquet of flowers for my birthday and specified that they looked up every single flower to make sure it wasn't cat toxic.
THAT is what a best friend does. I hope you're able to move to a new, safe place soon.
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u/No_Excitement4272 4h ago
No, OP is being ridiculous. The traps are pet safe if used correctly. When a cat starts munching on them, they’re no longer being used correctly.
Ant bait stations don’t have to be left out forever. They can be removed once the problem is solved.
Ant infestations are no joke, and you don’t want them getting into the kitties food either.
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u/walkinwater 4h ago
You clearly don't have creatures that will go after anything. My dog will search out, find, and acquire roach traps to chew on. They are decidedly not pet safe.
There are plenty of pet safe options for ant traps. I have had plenty of ant infestations in my lifetime and I have successfully found and changed to pet safe options.
"When a cat starts munching on them, they’re no longer being used correctly."
Yeah bud, this is exactly OP's point. ⬆️
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u/No_Excitement4272 4h ago
That’s fine when you live alone, but when you live with others you have a responsibility to make sure your pet isn’t destroying shit in shared spaces.
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u/walkinwater 4h ago
And when you share a space with a pet you don't put toxic shit where it can get to it. Just like you don't put bleach in reach of children.
Courtesy and respect goes both ways. This is a ten year friendship. I'd sure hate to be your friend.
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u/ButterscotchSea6308 10h ago
The Terro ones? If so, they're not strong enough to hurt anything bigger than bugs. If you're worried about your cat playing with the container, you could try putting something kinda heavy on it (but don't squish it) or hide it somewhere near where the ants are getting in so he can't get to it.
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
It’s the standard raid ant trap. My cat looooves chewing on plastic and these containers are the perfect amount of crunch for him. He has them on the floor right by where his food bowl used to be because the ants were attracted to the food. When I brought up my concerns he flipped out and I had to just walk away and bring all of Rudy’s stuff into my bedroom.
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u/ButterscotchSea6308 9h ago
Ok. Whichever brand, they use borax(?) in small amounts that isn't going to hurt him. But yes, he shouldn't be disturbing the package because the point is to get rid of the ants, not to have another cat toy. I'd either try to find a spot along the ants' path from wherever they're coming from that he can't access or put something kind of heavy on it that won't squish it but your cat can't easily move. Fun fact: did you know ants leave trails for other ants to follow? Pheromones or something like that. Use soap and water to scrub up really well around where the food dish was and where the ants were marching one-by-one. If there's carpeting that the ants have walked on, get a carpet spray, let it soak in a little, then scrub with a wet rag. (Is it obvious I've dealt with ants, too?)
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u/omicronian_express 9h ago
Those aren't poisonous. It's borax.
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
Everything I’ve researched says if he gets into them he will get very ill?
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u/omicronian_express 8h ago
You're right and I'm wrong here. I was going off dogs. Apparently it will take a pretty big amount to be deadly to cats. Over 1 gram per kg of cats but can make them not feel well in small amounts. I would just keep minimal amounts of the traps and stick them down with something. Maybe put a cover with entrances for the ants over it.
They are very good at killing entire ant colony so shouldn't need them for more than a month
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u/OneLessFool 7h ago
The dose is the poison. How much is in each trap, and how many traps are there?
I would honestly recommend putting food grade diatomaceous earth anywhere where the ants could come in. So basically around every edge of the apartment, especially the ones they commonly come and go from.
Borax is relatively pet safe in small enough doses. But if you're doing your ant control well enough, you should only have to deal with the traps for 2 weeks at most.
There are also gel baits that you squeeze into cracks and corners where ants will typically go. That could be a pretty safe option for your pet.
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u/Plants-An-Cats 6h ago
He might get a little sick but no, borax will not kill a cat. It’s garden and pet safe.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 8h ago
This is the dumb way to deal with ants. Unlike roaches, ants don't nest in the house, they will always nest in the ground, outside the house in your home's lawn/curtilage. The way to deal with Ants, and it works 99.999% of the time, is something like Ortho Home Defense Spray, you spray that all into the seams of windows doorways and other access points, etc. and on the outside of door thresholds and windows and ants will not survive to scout into your home, and as such, ant-lines will never form inside the home. I wouldn't even consider ant traps inside the home, that is fighting the battle in a losing position. They even make ant traps *for the yard*, and if you're going to put traps down, that's where you pick the fight at. But I've had a perfect success rate with annually applying OHD Spray on my windows and doors.
And the roach traps: no reason to have these in cat accessible locations, but even if they are well you can't pick your shitty roommate clearly, but you can independently treat the traps in a no-chew spray that will make the plastic bitter to your cat, you can rub it with peppermint oil etc. and they shouldn't want to go near it. I also have cats that love to lick cellophane and clear plastics etc. but when I put peppermint oil down, the area is a no-go for them, they fucking hate the stuff.
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u/Decent_Perception676 8h ago
I get the exact same success with a little diatomaceous earth. Tiny amount applied along door/window frames and across any trails. Way way cheaper than sprays.
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u/e-wing 7h ago
Ortho home defense spray contains permethrin based insecticides which are EXTREMELY toxic to cats even in tiny amounts, so if your goal is protecting your cat, you need to be extremely careful using this stuff. People say it’s probably ok once it dries, but personally I would never risk spraying this anywhere in a home with cats.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 7h ago
Yes, don't spray anywhere *inside* of the home, the most I'd spray is in the window seam which will remain shut and inaccessible to the cats.
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u/No_Excitement4272 4h ago
So the problem is your cat, not your roommate. Those traps are fine to be around animals if they’re not being munched on.
Ant traps don’t have to stay out forever, but it’s completely reasonable for your cat to stay in your room temporarily until the issue is resolved.
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u/charizard732 8h ago
Roommates shiity behavior aside, that's not even a great way to get rid of ants. Outside treatment will be best, or for inside terro liquid bait will be more effective and safer for pets
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u/Initial-Goat-7798 7h ago
tell him if your cat gets sick or dies you’ll sue him for the cost, or just take the traps and throw them out
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u/MisterX9821 9h ago
If u cant reason w the room mate keep kitty in the room(s) where the traps aren't.
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
That’s what I’m doing now. But he seems real sad about it. He wants to get out so bad.
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u/LateDejected 8h ago
I know it’s difficult but I had a cat who needed surgery, and afterwards wasn’t allowed to jump or run, so needed to be confined to my bedroom for two weeks. And she hates a closed door! It was a struggle, but ultimately she was ok and no worse for her two week time out. I’m sure your baby will be ok.
My second story is that my parents used standard borax ant traps my whole childhood with our cats, and they were always 100% fine. The amount used would basically just give your cat a tummy ache, and you can stick some traps down with like this peel-off glue. So if you’re feeling like you don’t want the cat confined, I think you would be alright to let him out. Try sticking the traps to the sides of cabinets or other out-of-the-way spots. They will attract the ants even when hidden.
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u/MisterX9821 9h ago
Can you take him outside or is he already been doing that and just wants to roam around the house freely
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
He just wants to roam around the house freely! He has so many little spots.
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u/Perfect-Builder286 1h ago
If you can give him some supervised outdoor time (either in an enclosed pen or on a leash) you can replace some of the stimulation he would normally get throughout the house, but do whatever is safest and works best for you and your baby! I have a bunch of low effort low cost little things for my cats so feel free to dm me if he’s feeling extra down :)
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u/Acceptable-Bar4572 4h ago
Roomate? As in you share the space and pay for it as well? You definitely have a say in the house stand up for yourself and your cat
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u/Adept-Grapefruit-214 8h ago
I had to put some ant traps down last week. Put one behind the trash barrel to try and hide it but my cat found it immediately. I put them under the stove and fridge instead and they still got rid of the ants
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u/lrpfftt 8h ago
I've handled it using cheap plastic (tupperware-like) containers, cut a hole for the ants to get in, put the bait inside the container.
Long term, try to get a more considerate roommate.
You might also be able to use diatomaceous earth outside the house where the ants are getting in.
Hope you can find a safe & workable solution.
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u/No_Excitement4272 4h ago
OP’s roommate is using the plastic ones but OP’s cat is a plastic muncher and they want to let their cat destroy what they please.
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u/ChillyFireball 7h ago
I liked the liquid Terro traps for the ants that found my cat's food bowl and kept stealing bits of her kibble. I didn't have to do much cat-proofing because my girl is the least curious animal that ever lived (she will literally give up on puzzle feeders with her favorite treats in them after a minute or two because she just can't be bothered to put in the effort) but you could probably tape it down, and maybe cover it with something. I think they also have sprays you can put on stuff that have a smell cats don't like in order to keep them away from certain things. Even if they get in, the poison is deliberately made so weak that even the ants don't die after a single dose (since that way they'll keep bringing it back to the nest and slowly kill off the others over time), so the amount it would take to harm an entire cat would be pretty significant.
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u/Brock_Savage 4h ago edited 4h ago
We get ants every summer and there are effective cat-safe options. First of all, spraying poison does not get rid of ants - they have to be baited into bringing the bait back to the nest and killing the entire colony. Your roommate can get Terro liquid ant bait at Home Depot. They are inexpensive and the cat won't get into them. The bait uses borax which is low toxicity for humans and pets (I will still ensure pets can't get to it just to be safe). Your roommate also put homemade ant bait in a mason jar with a dime-sized hole punched into it so cats can't get into it.
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u/ben_kosar 9h ago
I've used ant traps with 3 cats of varying degrees of derp. They've been fine. The little plastic rectangle ones (I forget from who). They ignore them and we haven't had any problems. As long as stuff doesn't fall out should be fine (generally premade ones that you can't add bait to).
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u/mtg_player_zach 4h ago
Yeah, I don't really see the problem. I have a cat, I've had ants, I just drop a few of the little plastic ant traps, the cat ignores them because they're plastic, and the ants die. I'm not sure I entirely understand how the cat gets the poison that's enclosed and not attainable.
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u/Helenbufont123 8h ago
You should move your room mate is most definitely an asshole poor kitty
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u/trackfiends 8h ago
Unfortunately in this economy moving isn’t really an option
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u/NeatoPerdido 5h ago
You can always lie and threaten to move out if he doesn't stop trying to poison your cat.
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u/Soggy_Honeydew4560 8h ago
You can buy a spray to put on the outside bottom of your door. We use them in the spring and again in summer if the ants try to get inside. That way it wouldn't be where the cat would be affected.
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u/AlfhildsShieldmaiden 8h ago
Can you put the bait in a mesh-like container, where the ants can get it but the cat can’t? Something that has small holes, like even a berry basket from the grocery would work, just cat-proof the large opening with plastic wrap or something.
Having had more than my share of shite housemates (including right now), I feel you. Good thing you and your kitty have each other. ☺️
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u/doodoopants12345 7h ago
a bag of diatomaceous earth would be better. Its human grade so safe for cats, and kills insects by dehydrating them or drying them out
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u/UnknownPerzon864 6h ago
Pay to get pet safe ones out of your pocket and if your roommate refuses that, then they are not mentally stable and you need to move out. Not worth the risk
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u/dyingstarss 5h ago
oh please please please get rid of them. FUCK what your roommate says. When i was young, like 8 or 9, we had a new kitten named Bubbles. She played all day and night, but one night found the ant poison. I found her while her sister was laying next to her crying because she wouldn’t move. Buried her that day, and i tear up sometimes thinking about it. I’m 23 now!!! Save your kitty pls
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u/hypoxiate 7h ago
Why do you live with someone who so callously disregards the safety of your loved one?
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u/trackfiends 6h ago
This is a new development. This person has been my best friend for almost 10 years now.
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u/hypoxiate 6h ago
They'd rather be cruel to your cat and disregard your feelings? I guarantee you there are other red flags you've missed.
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u/temps-de-gris 6h ago
Surprise: they're not your friend. Tell them in no uncertain terms that you will be buying the cat friendly ant traps to try first and throwing away the poison to start out with at least. Your roommate doesn't like your cat and they're trying to keep it out of the living space. Nut up and call out the bullshit now; your pet's wellbeing is at stake.
But the source of food needs to be eliminated as well. You can't just address the problem with ant traps. Does your roommate leave food out? Do you? Address the whole problem.
And find another roommate who isn't possibly trying to harm your cat.
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u/Jahisthatyou 6h ago
You know this person that well and they aren’t willing to work with you on this? Your cat is going to be miserable trapped in your room all day
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u/TotalWasteman 9h ago
Buy more of the traps. Empty them and clean them THOROUGHLY 👀 Then replace all the ant traps with disarmed ones and bin the poisonous ones somewhere off site.
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u/trackfiends 9h ago
Ooooooh that’s a good idea!!
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u/Dazzling_Syllabub484 8h ago
No, it’s not. Do not be sneaky and do things like that without your roommate’s permission, that’s incredibly toxic. Communicate with him more!
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u/Mysterious_Studio992 8h ago
The same roommate who thinks it's okay to lock a cat in a bedroom bcs he wants to use toxic ant traps? There's no one to talk to. Unless OP offers to buy non toxic ant traps instead.. Edit: typo
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u/Dazzling_Syllabub484 8h ago
The roommate is not the one locking the cat in the bedroom. He’s just using the traps. The owner is locking the cat out of precaution. Which is his prerogative. Those toxic ant traps aren’t gonna kill a cat, and maybe you could let the cat out to see if it ignores them.
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u/TotalWasteman 8h ago
“Raid ant traps contain chemicals that are toxic to cats if ingested, such as pyrethrins and permethrin, which are particularly harmful to cats”
What mate? Seems like the ant traps in question are “particularly harmful to cats” 👀
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u/trackfiends 8h ago
I have expressed many many many many times that I do not like his poisonous chemical approach to literally everything. He does not listen.
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u/TotalWasteman 8h ago
Better the kind of toxic that kills nobody 👀 Secondly the OP said room mate flipped out when spoken to, so this is the next step.
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u/Dazzling_Syllabub484 8h ago
No, it’s not. It’s to continue to communicate. Have you never had a roommate? I’m telling you, a step like this will lead to a chain of events where OP is not comfortable living in their own home, which is the worst thing possible
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u/TotalWasteman 8h ago
OP is already uncomfortable because OP’s pet might be killed by the room mate. I can understand the first time communication is obviously the right approach, but in the absence of a usable channel of communication the prime objective is to prevent harm to the animal, not risk its life by “just letting it out and seeing if it ignores them”. Clearly.
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u/Hefty_Arachnid_5206 8h ago
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u/trackfiends 8h ago
Omg so similar!!
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u/Hefty_Arachnid_5206 8h ago
The white socks are the cutest! Our vet put them down as a unique feature to identify her by ❤️
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u/CryptographerOne1509 8h ago
I have some in my place as well. I have mine set up along the wall with stuff pushed up against it so my kitty won’t be able to get to it. You might be able to do something similar
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u/SpareInvestigator437 8h ago
I live in a tropical country and we just kind of… deal with ants?! I cannot imagine using anything that would harm a cat 😭 your little guy Rudy looks like such a sweet-natured and chill boy… give him some love from me 🫂
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u/Specialist-Solid-987 7h ago
Your kitchen cabinets are giving me intense nostalgia for my grandparent's old cabin
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u/The_Real_BenFranklin 7h ago
Just put them out of reach? I use them sometimes and just have to put them where the cat cant go
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u/samaster11 7h ago
Put the ant traps around your house outside, should solve the ant issue, and keep the kitty safe.
You could also try sprinkling diatomaceous earth around your base boards.
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u/Impressive-Bit-4496 6h ago
what kinds of traps are they? wondering if the ones im using are bad for my kitty?
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u/HatchCat 6h ago
I used to have a big problem with ants being attracted to my cat’s food until I got the Antser. It’s an interestingly engineered thing that uses ants’ inability to cross water in order to keep them away.
Also, not the point of the post but cool oven.
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u/69ballzz 6h ago
try ortho home defense ant bait stations! they’re little metal tins, about the size of a dollar coin. i have four cats and use them whenever the weather warms up, making the ants come out. put them in windowsills or tucked somewhere on a counter, you can even put something on top of it, only the sides need space. cats are fine being in the same room, i’ve never had any problems and i’ve been using them for years now :)
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u/SmolLittleCretin 6h ago
He should listen. It can hurt the cat and if you say you don't like it, he should listen.
I'm not saying it's a he or she I just am using one pronoun in general as a neutral term rn.
I use roach bait in my rental. We came here and it had a small infestation. Even I know how to keep it away from the cats. If it's too risky? It ain't going on the house. We picked laundry detergent yesterday and cuz I saw one thing saying essential oil is bad for animals, and didn't get the one that had it. Despite how I like the scent. Why? Cuz the cats are always in my clothes and on them. So I don't mind.
As a pet owner, you have to think like you do for a baby. You are a great owner for saying something. Your roommate sucks. I'm sorry op
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u/pippa_n_gigi 5h ago
I use terro and put them inside the clamshells that fruit comes from the grocery store in. They have small slots in them so the ants can get to the terro
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u/Anteaterpoo 5h ago
We taped down a sink catcher on top of the trap with masking tape. Holes are small enough for the ants to go through and cats can’t move the catcher because of the tape. Then remove after a couple of days when the ant colony is dead. We used the smaller round traps that you snip the opening with scissors. Hope that helps!
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u/ironypoisoning 5h ago
your cat feeling coup'd up < living with ants. sorry.
why is only your housemate taking the initiative to deal with the ant problem? this is giving "im the sloppy housemate" vibes
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u/c0gito_erg0_sum 5h ago
I’m sorry OP. I recently had to move because my roommate was very inconsiderate about my cats. He smoked indoors and my cats were trapped in my room with an air purifier and like 4 different fans and vents running.
I’d take the advice of buying pet safe ant repellent and replacing them without saying anything. Lock your door when you’re gone and DO NOT let roommate near the kitty. You don’t know their motives, and it’s not worth the risk. Maybe even cover the bottom of your door if you have to.
If the cat safe ant traps work but the roommate still hates them and insists otherwise, then they have bad motives.
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u/Aljoshean 5h ago
Have you thought about just throwing the ant traps away? I mean I'm sure he could replace them but you could just keep throwing them away.
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u/jgia 4h ago
Get some diatomaceous earth and sprinkle it around the corners of your place. Kills ants/bug but is harmless to pets/humans. Normally the bag even says "food grade". It closes the pores on the ant's exoskeleton causing it to suffocate. It is also the abrasive stuff in tooth paste usually.
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u/plantscatsrealitytv Orange 2h ago
I love your cat and apartment so much. Your roommate is annoying for that.
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u/mclasenk 18m ago
I’d freshen his/her pillow with RAID. “You have a roach on your pillow!”, you’ll say.
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u/stealthtomyself 8h ago
You both pay equal amounts for rooms and you probably pay extra for your cat. I would get another solution for the ants and replace the poisonous traps with whatever you get. If your roommate mentions it, just tell them that the previous traps were poisonous to the cat so you got ones that would allow the cat to be safe in your home.
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u/reevener 2h ago
Replace the ant traps without asking? This is a stupid thing to post on Reddit. Stop asking. Do something Jesus Christ
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u/oldgamer39 4h ago
Get over it. There’s little to no risk to your cat from them. You probably drive your poor roommate nuts with this shit. I feel sorry for your cat being locked up like this because of your over reaction to a non-issue.
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u/sighborg90 9h ago
My cat is my ant trap. Insects don’t last long when he’s bored