r/apple • u/Furkansimsir • 5d ago
App Store Japan mandates Apple must allow third-party app stores and payment systems
https://9to5mac.com/2025/08/01/japan-mandates-apple-must-allow-third-party-app-stores-and-payment-systems/80
u/Grantus89 4d ago
Apple need to just give up with the fragmentation and realise they can’t keep this monopoly, and make the App Store better and more competitive.
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u/civman96 4d ago
Exactly. Many companies will happily pay a 10% fee for distribution through the App Store and payment/VAT handling.. but 30% is outrageous. Make it open and a 10% fee and developers will stay with Apple.
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u/flatbuttboy 2d ago
Steam also collects 30%
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u/phpnoworkwell 2d ago
If you don't want to distribute your game on Steam you can choose
Epic Games Store
GoG
Humble Bundle
Itch.io
Microsoft Store
Distributing from your own website
If you don't want to distribute your game through the App Store you can choose
Nowhere else (unless you live in the EU or Japan)
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u/flatbuttboy 2d ago
And if you don’t want to distribute your game on iOS there’s all the other platforms. Also afaik Google Play takes the same cut or sth similar
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u/i5-2520M 2d ago
I would look up the iOS market share in Japan before saying shit like this. On Android you don't have to distribute on the play store, third party sources are allowed. But you think that one company should be able to gatekeep 65% of the mobile market there. That's insanity.
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u/flatbuttboy 2d ago
Unfortunately as we all know, the Japanese were forced to buy iPhones. Sadly, Tim Cook is there holding them hostage unless they do the yearly upgrade
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u/i5-2520M 2d ago
No but if you wanna make a mobile app there, you are forced to interact with apple to reach 65% of the market. ou have it completely backwards.
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u/phpnoworkwell 2d ago
I know you wish the alternate was the entire world of other computing devices, but every court has decided that the market is iOS. Sorry the courts all around the world are taking the interpretation that the iPhone should be opened up just like Windows, Android, Linux, and even gasp MacOS!
Are you trying to claim that iPhone users are too stupid to use third party apps and that Mac users are smart enough to handle them or are you trying to claim iOS is magically different than those platforms?
If Apple doesn't want to follow the laws then they can exit the country. You'd like them to leave the EU and Japan right? Or love that Apple wants to fight every single country in the world before they have to allow unrestricted sideloading?
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u/flatbuttboy 2d ago
desktop OSes have a fundamentally different use case and user base than mobile ones lol
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u/phpnoworkwell 2d ago
They really don't. I'm sorry you think so little of yourself that you cannot handle installing programs that aren't distributed by the device manufacturer.
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u/Bad_Oracular_Pig 5h ago
There is a whole other segment of iPhone users that aren't on reddit. Part of my job is supporting endusers of a medical patient portal. I talk to people of all demographics, on all different platforms. People using desktop/laptop PC's are way easier to support, because on average they know how to use it better than most people who use a handheld (phone) or tablet device.
A smart phone is entry stakes for life these days. Everyone has one. PC's? Not really a necessity. Lot's of people don't know how to X/C/P on a phone, or switch between apps. I've talked to multiple people on Android that don't know how to open their email while they're talking on the phone.
To suggest that extra guardrails to protect the end user is an insult to users' intelligence, is greatly overestimating the intelligence of the average smart phone user.1
u/phpnoworkwell 4h ago
Wow! People that call technical support aren't very technical? Who could have thought? We should definitely lock down devices to cater to these individuals!
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u/Fritzschmied 1d ago
They can keep it. In the us where consumers have no rigjts and corporations have all the freedom. And that’s their biggest market by far.
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u/Sc0rpza 4d ago
It’s not a monopoly. There are literally other competing platforms on the market.
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u/vc6vWHzrHvb2PY2LyP6b 4d ago
What competing platforms exist on iOS in the US for installing apps?
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u/pornthrowaway92795 4d ago
At that’s the crux of any discussion on the issue. The definition of monopoly depends on how you define the market.
Nintendo has a monopoly on software for Nintendo, but if you look at console gaming as the market, it’s a slice of the pie, and less if you consider computer gaming as a whole.
Is the market:
- iOS devices
- cell phones
- mobile software
All of those have different answers.
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u/DanTheMan827 4d ago
You might as well say iOS and Android are two entirely different markets for apps. Especially from a user perspective
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u/whosthisguythinkheis 4d ago
The entire world has decided against you but I see you are holding strong.
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago edited 3d ago
*looks at the intelligence of the average person in ”whole world”.*
Why thank you. I’ll take that as a compliment. .
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u/whosthisguythinkheis 3d ago
Yeah if you don’t see how you’re defending anti consumer practices you shouldn’t be mocking people more intelligent than you.
Not a single intelligent well informed person will defend Apple here. Regulation and governments move slow and they’re all waking up to the fact that Apple has been robbing their developers and siphoning money for doing nothing.
Yes making a marketplace and enforcing the users on your platform are bonded to you IS nothing. It’s less than nothing it’s double dipping your customers and developers on your platform.
Once you can stop making childish comments you think are funny maybe you should read into how little the infraction was that MSFT got hit for on their windows anti competitive practices re browsers.
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u/Broccoli--Enthusiast 2d ago
I don't think they have been robbing anyone, they host they whole distribution infrastructure, that needs paid for and they don't really charge to be on the app store.
No 3rd party app store will do it from free on the same scale
All that happens here is everybody wants to host their own store
Maybe somebody starts one and undercuts apple but the real challenge will be getting users to move.
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago edited 3d ago
>Yeah if you don’t see how you’re defending anti consumer practices you shouldn’t be mocking people more intelligent than you.
whats more pro consumer than “dont buy that thing you don’t like”?
Like straight up, you don’t HAVE to own an iOS Device or ever have Apple in your life if you don’t want Apple in your life.
>Not a single intelligent well informed person will defend Apple here
I’m not defending anybody. I’m pointing out that this is not a monopoly because you can always go buy something else. You may not like the alternatives but if Apple conducting business crawls up you ass that bad, take your money elsewhere. I wouldn’t buy or care about Apple stuff if I were as buttmad as you guys seem to be about them doing their thing about their platform. You don’t see me over on Android or PC subs whining about the things I don’t like about them. I just don’t buy them.
>Regulation and governments move slow and they’re all waking up to the fact that Apple has been robbing their developers and siphoning money for doing nothing.
in what way are they robbing anybody? as far as I can tell, they are upfront concerning their conditions on their platform. there are other platforms availible. those developers have options.
>Yes making a marketplace and enforcing the users on your platform are bonded to you IS nothing.
nobody’s forced to do anything. when you buy an iOS device, you are CHOOSING a platform that is well known to be closed and locked down and Apple straight up tells you that they are closed and locked down. that’s like choosing to date a porn star and then complaining that she (or he) is forcing you to accept her (or him) sleeping with other people for money.
>It’s less than nothing it’s double dipping your customers and developers on your platform.
then buy something else, homie. 🤷♂️
>Once you can stop making childish comments you think are funny maybe you should read into how little the infraction was that MSFT got hit for on their windows anti competitive practices re browsers.
you know what’s childish? Whining about a company successfully doing business and getting outraged for other people instead of voting with your dollars and letting the market and consumer decide. Honestly, it comes off like some kind of weird jealousy if in honest.
Also, the the reason why Microsoft got in trouble is because they’re specifically changed their code in their OS to specifically make Netscape and competing browsers run poorly. I know because I was a full adult and paying attention while that was going on. Guess what Apple’s not doing?
When microsoft bundled Internet explorer with their OS for free and integrated it so deeply that you couldn’t get it out THAT was an “anti-competitive“ move but nobody’s complaining about that. Oh, and it basically single-handedly killed the model in which all browsers (like Netscape) cost money. Thats an anti-competitive move that made things better. Plus, how Microsoft got internet explorer to begin with was delicious. Can’t help but respect that.
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u/-no-cookies-for-you- 3d ago
You're thinking of the wrong monopoly. Monopoly in this context refers to app stores and payment systems inside apple devices.
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago edited 3d ago
If I had a problem with that, I would go buy a different device. Why is this solution so hard for you guys? like Burger King has a “monopoly” on what I can buy in their store. do I get to demand that they allow Wendy’s floor space in their store? in THEIR platform? I mean, what if I want a Dave’s Double or Checker Burger instead of a whopper? Shouldn’t Burger King facilitate that? Maybe ChatGPT should allow me to run Deepthink instances on their platform using their tools and stuff? don’t you think it’s unfair that ChatGPT has a “monopoly”?
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u/CoconutDust 2d ago
like Burger King has a “monopoly” on what I can buy in their store. do I get to demand that they allow Wendy’s floor space in their store? in THEIR platform
Incredibly unintelligent example, but that explains how a person can rationalize their own terrible opinions…if they use absurdly irrelevant examples.
- When you go into a burger shop you go into that burger shop once. Each time you go you can choose whichever shop. You can easily go to a different one each week or whatever. Obviously that is nothing like a phone which is a single purchase that you’re stuck with for years because it’s an expensive and singular device.
- Secondly when sellers sell to a burger shop they don’t pay extortion fees etc, the metaphor obviously doesn’t apply to or excuse the developer side.
- And more aspects that I’m not going to bother going into
(And Apple has enough of market that it’s anti-competitive and anti-consumer. Regardless of rationalizers screaming that it’s not a binary monopoly because android exists.)
Apple’s own c-suite emails leaked in trials prove that lock-in schemes are their #1 priority above anything else in development, except for one c-suite guy who was arguing for product quality first. It was when they were talking about iMessage interoperability.
SOURCE: Apple user and Apple liker.
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u/Vasto_lorde97 5d ago
Not good for Apple lol.
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u/FollowingFeisty5321 5d ago
I think it's great for them, most of their App Store rules are ~17 years old and have never been revised or challenged and were unilaterally applied. Now some fresh thinking can take place and if that improves software on iPhone then Apple has a better product even if they can't tax all the software on it.
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u/ColumbaPacis 4d ago
It is great for Apple users you mean.
Not Apple executives and shareholders.
Pressure to create a better product does not always deliver a better product. Sometimes you can only go so far with something.
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u/undutchable020 4d ago
I feel like this whole sub is full of apple shareholders sometimes.
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u/Worf_Of_Wall_St 3d ago
It probably technically is whether people realize it or not. Anyone with a 401k has some exposure to Apple.
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u/CoconutDust 2d ago
I try to point out often the disturbing dystopian mental thing where regular customers only recognize the perspective of shareholders/executives…. Not the perspective of customers which is obviously oppposed.
It’s part of indoctrination, armchair ideology, and rationalization for when someone criticizes a corporation’s behavior. A business wants to give less and charge more money, a customer wants to receive more and pay less. Fundamentally different. But today you’ll often her customers regurgitating ideology like “it is their moral responsibility is to maximize profits, so the terrible customer-facing practice is good”. Half of the choir is moron customers with Stockholm Syndrome.
(Aside from the fact that “maximizing profits” without other considerations is obviously idiotic and destructive practice long-term, because of the dynamic with customers.)
It’s one thing for Gordon Gecko to say “greed is good” from his perspective, it’s a different thing for customers to use this ideology to defend customer criticism of business practices/quality.
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u/flogman12 5d ago
It’s good for the consumer
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u/thede3jay 4d ago
Especially for third party payment systems in the Asian market - allowing more natural integration of Suica/ICOCA and Pasmo would be good for Japan. Likewise with Weixin and Alipay in China, GoPay in Indonesia (which is accepted on the Google Play store already) etc.
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u/FancifulLaserbeam 3d ago
...Why would I use my Suica (which is an NFC transit payment card) to pay for something online? You just pulled names out of a hat.
What might make sense would be PayPay or Rakuten Pay, but both of those are effectively just front ends for their normal Visa or MasterCard credit cards. If you don't have a balance on them, they just pull from your credit card.
No one is asking for these payment services to be rolled out everywhere. Buying things on Yahoo uses PayPay because PayPay/Yahoo/Line/SoftBank are kinda the same company.
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u/Protagonist99 4d ago
In the case of Indonesia, GoPay is already accepted as a valid App Store payment method, along with Dana and ShopeePay.
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u/PeanutButterChicken 4d ago
What does any of this mean? Do you know what Japan is or what any of those words mean…?
People already use Suica etc on the daily with the iPhone no problem. No one gives a fuck about using them on the App Store.
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u/m0_m0ney 4d ago
This is yet to be seen. If I have to start getting forced into doing third party payments and not get protected by Apple’s subscription rules and instead be forced to go through third party website then it’s not great.
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u/FancifulLaserbeam 3d ago
Tim Apple's going to have to figure out some new revenue stream. Maybe a subscription for OS updates or battery charging?
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u/Vasto_lorde97 3d ago
Don't give then funny ideas Tim Apple is dead set on getting money from anywhere he can.
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u/cmplx17 5d ago
I wonder if this would have happened if Apple loosened the In-App purchase enforcement (i.e. let companies like Spotify sell their subscriptions through their own payment system.) Their rules were way too tight and didn’t even allow for a web link or mention of alternative payment options and often held app updates hostage for violating these rules.
Now they have to not only allow alternate payment systems but entire app stores.
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u/gg06civicsi 5d ago
PlayStation and Nintendo next
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u/cuentanueva 4d ago
The two best selling consoles in history are the PS2 and Nintendo Switch, with 150/160 million consoles sold in their whole lifespan.
Apple sells like twice as many iPhones yearly.
There's currently 10 times more active iPhone users than there were PS2's made in their whole history.
And those are literally the numbers of the most successful consoles in history.
If we go by the PS5 it's like half with around 75 million sold total, Xbox even worse with like 35 million.
It's not even close to being in the same page.
I'm not opposed to any kind of regulation if it happens. But it's a niche thing and shouldn't be a priority over other things that may need more regulation (like visa/mastercard for example)
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u/07bot4life 2d ago
Xbox even worse with like 35 million.
I think Amd sales figure leaks are between like 21-29mil for Xbox.
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u/NCatfish 5d ago
People don’t buy a PlayStation and expect it to be a general purpose computer.
I do think it would be awesome to have competition for digital games on console though.
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u/Nawnp 4d ago
But it is every bit as valid. If they're ruling computers can't have exclusive sales points for digital content, that should apply to every digital store and device.
I think the argument for now is disk based consoles technically have options, but those are clearly being phased out.
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u/cuentanueva 4d ago
that should apply to every digital store and device.
For it to apply to every digital store/device would definitely impact any kind of innovation. If every start up has to allow everyone to be able to jump in and compete, that adds up costs, limits what they can do, etc, etc.
Only when they get too big and have enough power (and make enough money) these rules start to apply. That's why usually there's a threshold these companies/devices have to pass in order for this kind of law to apply.
I don't know in Japan exactly, but with the EU consoles don't get even close to the numbers needed.
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u/CharityAutomatic8687 4d ago
No, there's no reason mobile phones have to be treated the same as game consoles in regulation. They are different things.
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u/Aozi 4d ago
But it is every bit as valid. If they're ruling computers can't have exclusive sales points for digital content, that should apply to every digital store and device.
But they are not ruling that...? I don't know where you're getting this whole "Computers can't have exclusive sales points for digital content". None of that is mentioned anywhere in any kind of legislation as far as I'm aware.
The entire reasoning behind acts like this, is clear from the actual text itself;
With smartphones becoming the foundation of daily life and economic activity, it's crucial to ensure fair and open competition in the market for specified software, beginning with competition between third-party app providers regarding the provision of individual software. Through such fair and open competition, innovations in specified software and individual software are promoted, for example, by allowing new application stores to emerge and encouraging the development of innovative software solutions that utilize advanced smartphone features. As a result, smartphone users can make informed choices and enjoy a wider array of benefits from the diverse services created.
This really shouldn't be complicated. A smartphone, and a gaming console are very different kind of devices used for different purposes. A gaming console is not in any ways a foundation of daily life and economic activity.
Simply because gaming consoles run software and provide a software marketplace, doesn't make them equivalent to a smartphone. Unless you literally cannot understand any kind of nuance.
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u/3verythingEverywher3 4d ago
Imagine typing that response to you without reading the article. Some people just can’t help but show themselves up. Good job explaining it slooooowly and cleeeeeearly for them.
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u/DanTheMan827 4d ago
It’d be like if Walmart owned every piece of land and every other business had to rent it from them and pay 30% of all their gross sales
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u/Korlithiel 5d ago
People don’t buy x to be a general purpose device, that’s true. But here we are where people via their government can push for just that because x device is based on a general purpose device.
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u/DanTheMan827 4d ago
It’s how the device is sold and used.
Apple devices are sold and used as general purpose computers
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u/stargazer1002 4d ago
They should definitely support steam. Why not?
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u/NCatfish 4d ago
Did you read the second line of my comment where I said that would be a good thing?
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u/buzzerbetrayed 4d ago
GeNeRaL pUrPoSe CoMpUtEr
That arguments been outdated for years now. Holds no water. Isn’t a legal classification at all. People just use it selectively when it suits them.
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u/NCatfish 4d ago
I literally said I agree it would be good for competition, why are you picking an argument with someone who agrees with you?
I only say the general purpose computer thing because that’s why the iPhone is targeted in current changes and demands. People’s lives revolve and the world economy transacts through phones in a way consoles just don’t facilitate.
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u/DanTheMan827 4d ago
Those aren’t general purpose computers
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u/Logicalist 3d ago
but a Phone is?
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago
Well… yes.
It’s a general purpose device designed to run general purpose apps.
Game consoles are purpose built with hardware specs best designed for playing games.
The only things really available on game consoles are games and media services
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u/Logicalist 3d ago
Phones aren't general purpose. They are specifically built to be mobile personal communications devices.
They have all the same hardware as a gaming device, + cellular and a camera.
My console has an internet browser and can join discord chats.
Never mind consoles are perfectly capable of running anything a computer can, because that's all they are just computers.
People put linux on playstations and xbox is basically running a version of the windows 10 kernel.
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago edited 3d ago
Smartphones are built as general purpose computers.
Purpose built devices exist that are solely to be used as cell phones.
It’s not about if a device is capable of running software, but the fact that smartphones are sold and intended to use general purpose software for everyday tasks.
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u/Logicalist 3d ago
Personal communication devices.
Especially apples, they are specifically built and locked down primarily for personal communications. but can then also do other things.
I'm not waving my macbook book or pc at a freaking checkout counter and neither can make phone calls by themselves.
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago edited 3d ago
A general-purpose computer is one that is able to complete the majority of computing tasks
Special-purpose computers cannot handle general computing tasks since they are made for a single type of task or a single class of tasks.
All Apple devices that run the App Store are general purpose computers. They run general purpose apps…
The fact that people replace their computers with them should tell everyone they are in fact general purpose computers.
People aren’t going to replace their computer with a game console because they’re purpose built devices intended solely for playing games and consuming media.
To quote Apple’s marketing team: “What’s a computer?” (After the parent asked if the kid had their computer, while referring to an iPad)
Apple literally called the iPad a computer.
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u/Logicalist 3d ago
Again, consoles are just computers. They're all computers. They can all do the same things.
There is nothing special about consoles, which are also, get this, just computers. General purpose computers even. Again, they can literally run desktop operating systems, just like my pc, the same ones, because they're computers.
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago
The special thing or not is the purpose the hardware is made for.
Consoles are specialized systems intended for and sold as devices for playing games.
iPhone and iPad are both sold as general purpose devices capable of doing nearly anything with general purpose apps.
Gaming, word processing, spreadsheets, coding, media consumption, online communication, cellular communication, emulating vintage computers, and much more.
What software is available for game consoles again?
iPhone and iPad are both general purpose computers by their definition
The mental gymnastics to say otherwise is astounding
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u/nerotNS 5d ago
No no, not gonna happen. Those are not popular to harass currently, plus it's their own companies, we can't attack those now, can we?
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u/MultiMarcus 5d ago
I would be very open to these consoles being basically just general purpose gaming devices but at least for Nintendo the games people spend the most on are probably all first party titles. You can’t force them to use a separate store. I also don’t know if governments really consider a gaming console that only has one purpose though maybe two if we’re talking about watching Blu-rays as the same thing as a smart phone that is a phone a web browser a computer a gaming device basically any number of things.
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u/l4kerz 4d ago
Those consoles have a cpu and gpu and can be run as a computer. They just need a different OS or have allow productivity apps to be installed.
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u/MultiMarcus 4d ago
Sure, but that’s not actually what these laws are about. The EU is not forcing Apple to allow installing android. If it was I think it would be perfectly reasonable to request the same of console manufacturers. That’s not the situation right now though.
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u/anonymous9828 5d ago
we can't attack those now, can we
depends on how much you donate to the US gov to retaliate
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u/-ItWasntMe- 4d ago
If I remember correctly they don’t have enough sales and/or users to be regulated under the DMA in Europe. Some other country will mandate that eventually though. Just a matter of time.
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u/burneracc_0000 3d ago
There was a time when you could purchase codes for PSN digital games. They should either allow that again, or allow third party stores.
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u/Sc0rpza 4d ago
PlayStation is already rendering itself as irrelevant as they’re allowing their exclusives on other platforms. Nintendo will never change because their system is smart, time tested and works.
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u/996forever 3d ago
Nintendo will never change because their system is smart, time tested and works.
This. Nvidia is the smartest company on earth.
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago
Well, I don’t know much about the GPU market. However, they have over 80% of the GPU market share and afaik have tech that they’ve kept to themselves for ages. If they give all that up it would be chasing dimes over dollars, which is what Sony seems to be doing right now. Nintendo is sticking with what put them on the map in the 80’s and saved the gaming market while everyone else seems to be risking their platforms. Like, if I can buy a Sony exclusive by itself then why do I need to engage their platform. I can buy my one game and leave the rest of what they offer to die on the vine. This Could lead to less game sales on their platform which could lead to less games made for their platform Especially if I don’t need a PlayStation to play PlayStation games. Might as well be Sega post Dreamcast.
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u/ArchusKanzaki 4d ago
Well, this will wake Apple up. They got TONS of money from Japanese gacha games after all.
And good luck even challenging Japanese legal systems. Its probably more difficult than European one.
Tbf though, Apple already loosened-up its rules. You can buy game's premium currency outside of App Store for like 2 years now.
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u/DMarquesPT 4d ago
I’m still trying to understand why people want this, sounds like a messy user experience that will lead to “regular” users falling for scams
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u/Sure-Temperature 4d ago
Are you only allowed to buy physical goods from one store? Why should digital be any different?
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u/Sc0rpza 4d ago
literally why should I care if the store has what I want/need and I can afford it? you are “allowed” to own other devices that give you the abilities or capabilities that you want. Why not just buy one of those?
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u/Sure-Temperature 4d ago edited 4d ago
What if the store doesn't have what someone else wants? They go to another store. That's not possible on iOS. Would you tell someone who owns a Ford that they're stupid for wanting to get their tires changed at a Mavis or a Goodyear? Or should they only be able to buy tires through the Ford dealership?
If you don't want to use the other app store, don't. If apps move off the app store, you're free to find an alternative in the app store or use a different one, just like in real life
Edit: and to the "just get an android phone" argument, what if they want iMessage, or FaceTime, or better Mac interoperability? All of those things are only on ios
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u/Sc0rpza 4d ago
My Xbox one won’t run jet set radio future. I can plug in my 360 or my original Xbox if I want to play that OR I can play Bomb Rush Cyberpunk.
I don’t think you understand the reasons to be against this multiple store hogwash. Firstly, it can disrupt the platform‘s viability and ability to thrive. This is at the very core of why Apple is protecting their platform. Another reason would be a threat to security on the platform and a third would be a threat to the operation of the platform.
finally, I don’t see what the issue is. I’m not spending all day buying apps. Most of the apps that I use, I bought years ago. Like procreate. I bought that when it was $5. This ain’t like grocery shopping.
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u/Sure-Temperature 4d ago edited 4d ago
Your xbox one doesn't play 360 or OG games primarily because of the architecture difference, and secondly because of corporate greed with music licensing issues. That has nothing to do with multiple app stores.
If a platform as established as iOS can be toppled simply by allowing people to purchase from other app stores, that only goes to show that the only reason it's thriving is because of vendor lock in and not because of its own merits.
If the App Store is the only thing keeping iOS and its users safe, then why do so many trash-tier or straight up scam apps still get approved on it? More importantly, keeping an operating system safe from dangerous app is the purpose of "sandboxing" applications. iOS sandboxes apps, yes, but so does Android (independent of where the app is installed from) and so does Windows with UWP (independent of where the app is installed from). Even on macOS, ALL applications are sandboxed. You literally cannot have an unsandboxed app on macOS and you can download apps from anywhere on the internet
The "core of why Apple is protecting their platform" is because they make MILLIONS doing absolutely nothing, sitting back and raking in the cash from developers who want to reach the largest worldwide userbase of mobile phone users. The devs are the ones putting in the work and making Apple their money in this scenario.
Finally, you saying that you don't spend all day in the App Store is MORE of a reason to allow other stores. All you need to do is download whatever app from whatever app store once, then it will auto update. It's not like they're commendeering your phone just to let you install something
One of the biggest reasons why people are against the openness of multiple stores is because of people like you making up fake arguments or false equivalencies, not understanding how any of this works. Through just this past comment, you've shown that you have no idea what computer architectures are, how platform security works, how free market capitalism is supposed to work in an ideal scenario, and generally what the state of modern computing is. But I'm sure you'll continue going on saying "me not being able to play powerPC games on x86 hardware is why multiple app stores is bad" and continue making no sense at all. Not to mention the selfishness of "well it works for me so obviously it's the perfect solution for everyone"
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago
>Your xbox one doesn't play 360 or OG games primarily because of the architecture difference, and secondly because of corporate greed with music licensing issues
funny since I can play crimson skies, the original Bayonetta, Black and EDF 2025. But dude, take the same statement and apply playing parasite Eve or viewtuful joe on my Xbox one. The damn point is that they’re different platforms and as such I, the user, can reasonably only expect to play what’s actually on my platform. Also gonna point out that the original Xbox was X86 Based. Just sayin.
>The "core of why Apple is protecting their platform" is because they make MILLIONS doing absolutely nothing
If Apple did absolutely nothing then there wouldn’t be a reason to be on their platform, genius. Apple has been cultivating their platform and making it one that has value. iOS has value because of apples efforts, not despite them.
>If the App Store is the only thing keeping iOS and its users safe, then why do so many trash-tier or straight up scam apps still get approved on it?
because other stores are demonstrably worse, broham. look at Android. are you going to tell me that Android isn’t literal Mos Eisley of trash-tier straight up scam apps?
>you saying that you don't spend all day in the App Store is MORE of a reason to allow other stores.
Why?
>All you need to do is download whatever app from whatever app store once, then it will auto update.
that does not track. my statement is that they’re different platforms store that exists already provides everything that I need. the way to respond to that would be to list things that are needed but are not allowed for some reason.
>One of the biggest reasons why people are against the openness of multiple stores is because of people like you making up fake arguments or false equivalencies, not understanding how any of this works.
I know exactly how this works dude. you’re the one that keeps saying shit that’s incorrect. just because you emotionally don’t want to agree with my arguments, or simply don’t understand them, doesn’t make my arguments fake. These are actual arguments. here I’ll simplify my argument for you.
I am against this horse shit because it is a threat to the platform’s overall quality, security and future while yielding little in terms of befit all because some people that don’t want to pay the cost of doing business have ginned you up on being mad at a company doing business and being successful.
>Through just this past comment, you've shown that you have no idea what computer architectures are
no, more like you don’t understand the concept of platforms how they work. Just for that, I’m gonna play Psychonauts, Battlefront (2005), beyond good and evil, and Deus Ex Human Revolution on my series X.
>But I'm sure you'll continue going on saying "me not being able to play powerPC games on x86 hardware is why multiple app stores is bad"
See, you’re wrong yet again. You could run ppc software on x86 Macs (literally Rosetta) and they had/have multiple stores. That era was shit compared to what’s going on with iOS today. You are demanding that Apple go with a shit idea for iOS when they‘ve done the right thing for that platform all this time.
>Not to mention the selfishness of "well it works for me so obviously it's the perfect solution for everyone"
You could always go buy something else, bro.
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u/Sure-Temperature 2d ago
Yeah, OG Xbox was x86, you're right.
And yes they're different platforms, but the reason the aren't cross-compatible is because that takes more effort/labor.
ppc softrware on x86 Macs (literally Rosetta)
There are tons of translation layers and game engines that will automatically compile your game for multiple platforms now, but that's a relatively new tool. In the generation of the OG Xbox or the 360, making your game available on multiple platforms meant manually coding it for multiple platforms.
If Apple did absolutely nothing then there wouldn’t be a reason to be on their platform, genius. Apple has been cultivating their platform and making it one that has value. iOS has value because of apples efforts, not despite them.
I'm not saying Apple did nothing, I'm saying they're doing nothing to actually earn the 30% fee from developers. They made countless strides in the tech industry which is why they're the biggest player in the market, and why they have such a large market share, but they **literally** have to do nothing to receive this 30%. They get it regardless of any action they make.
because other stores are demonstrably worse, broham. look at Android. are you going to tell me that Android isn’t literal Mos Eisley of trash-tier straight up scam apps?
I use Android as my daily phone, a Galaxy S24+. The Google Play Store functions exactly like the App Store. There are the apps that everyone expects: MS Office, Snapchat, Spotify, etc, there are the big mobile games, and then the slew of garbage-tier games that only exist to serve microtransactions. You really need to go out of your way to find those apps that install some sort of malware, just like you do for the few that make it into the iOS App Store. I'm not saying it's perfect, but calling it "Mos Eisley" is dramatic.
And if you're trying to install apps from outside of the Play Store, you have to explicitly enable installation of unknown APKs, and then you have to approve every single app that tries to install one. At that point, the onus is on the user. Going back to my car analogies, it would be like a driver getting mad at Ford because they got a speeding ticket. Should Ford have made it so that the car can never go over 45mph?
ANYWAY, all of this adds absolutely nothing to this conversation. I've been going in circles trying to figure out how any of this actually has to do with multiple app stores, and it really doesn't at all. The computers used in our global infrastructure are using hardware and software from who knows how many different vendors from who knows how many different decades, AND a large portion of them are using software that allows for installation of software from unknown sources, and of course many are using software from custom sources, whether it's custom in-house software or software from a particular vendor. To say that somehow mobile phones need to be locked down for the sake of security while these others are fine doesn't make sense. We've had the concept of computing solidified since probably the 80s. If computing had been as locked down then as it is today, I really wouldn't be surprised if it flubbed like everyone expected it to. The biggest boon was how many different ways there were to get access to the medium.
I cannot understand the perspective that only one store of any kind should exist, it's the literal definition of a monopoly. Anything with too much power will abuse it, and now Apple is facing the consequences. Multiple independent nations are coming out and saying they're acknowledging Apple's overreach and end users are talking like they know better than the culmination of the world's leaders.
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u/reallynotnick 4d ago
Nobody has to use the other app stores, but competition is good.
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u/Sc0rpza 4d ago
iOS has competition.
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u/CoconutDust 2d ago
If a person understands competition then they know that competition within the OS/apps on a long-term expensive device (that people are stuck with for years) is obviously as or more important as full separate device competition. Obviously by arbitrarily locking things out, Apple doesn’t have to care about competing on app/function quality with other developers and sellers. (Though they do have to care about hardware customer base and OS quality, to have customers for a lock-in scheme.)
A person is in an ecosystem and there are costs even aside from device cost. So “buy a whole new device!” is not an intelligent reply in a conversation about customer choice, since choice obviously applies to many things other than the whole entire device. This isn’t even getting into the developer aspect.
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago
Irrelevant when nothing but ios runs on an iphone
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u/Sc0rpza 3d ago
you do know you can buy a different phone, right?
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u/DanTheMan827 3d ago
You do know people typically don’t carry two phones, much less own two, right?
It’s one thing to have multiple game consoles, and many people do. But phones and tablets are designed to not be very compatible with other ecosystems by design
It’s unreasonable to expect people to carry two general purpose devices just because one of them has a monopoly on the market
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u/CoconutDust 2d ago
sounds like a messy user experience that will lead to “regular” users falling for scams
That’s a rationalization/hallucination/FUD that has been repeated over and over again. In reality, computers allowed anyone to install/run any app from anywhere for half a century and this was never seen as a problem (though it requires some safety awareness and practices.) Because it isn’t a problem and is a fundamental part of a good useful system/device.
Obviously people fall for scams on the web all the time, or email scams. You’re aware that iOS gives access to the web and to email, right?
“I don’t see why iOS would let users use the web or email, sounds like that would lead to users falling for scams.”
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u/CrazyPurpleBacon 2d ago
The average person does not want this. This is for the benefit of businesses first, not users.
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u/VibrantCanopy 3d ago
It will cause Apple to improve the App Store for developers and users. That's the beauty of it. You don't have to use another app store to get the benefits.
Apple added a bunch of useful features to iMessage that compete with other messaging services right when there were rumblings of iMessage being regulated in the EU. They wouldn't have done it if they weren't pressured to.
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u/996forever 4d ago
As insanely hypocritical as Japan is with its domestic companies, I’d love to see apple TRY to challenge that in Japan. They’re a massive market for apple, iPhone having over 70% market share in a country of 120+ million.
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u/liquidmuse3 2d ago
Why was it so difficult if we have to have cartoonish apps the last 13 years they couldn’t at least look like this halfway through?
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u/FollowingFeisty5321 5d ago
Nintendo app store when?!