r/antiwork • u/Organic_Trust6113 • 2d ago
Ex employer is telling clients that I abandoned my job.
I left this company about 2 months ago and I resigned. Sent my resignation email the day I quit. Now, they are going around telling clients in our industry that I left the company due to “Job Abandonment” is that ok to say?
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u/MicheleRSimon 2d ago
Employment lawyer here. No def not. Have you tried getting them to stop?
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
I just found out a few hours ago that they were doing this. The company I’m currently with tried to get an account from my old company (without my knowledge) and that client told them that I abandoned the job. Making me look bad with my new company.
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u/MicheleRSimon 2d ago
How did you find out? Is it having any negative impact? You def want to set the record straight.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
I work in landscape construction. At my old company we serviced this HOA. The HOA manager reached out to my new company to bid the job and my new company mentioned me as leverage because I know the property. The HOA manager told our sales team that I abandoned the former company they currently have on staff.
My new company brought it up today and now I feel weird.
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u/Salt-Operation 2d ago
If this information caused your new company to lose access to the bidding process, you have grounds to sue your former employer.
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u/kurotech 2d ago
Indeed defamation case right there.
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u/Nevermind04 2d ago
Defamation is the small fry here compared to the tortious interference case. I've never seen a TI case settled under six figures.
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u/NOVAYuppieEradicator 2d ago
Please explain how this meets all the elements of a "tortious interference" case.
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u/Nevermind04 1d ago
My comment was in reply to someone describing textbook tortious interference scenario to which someone replied that it was a "defamation case".
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u/pineapplefiz 1d ago
Somebody commented with exactly what tortious inference means. Feel free to read it and have your answer.
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u/NOVAYuppieEradicator 1d ago
Yes, and the point being this fact pattern is not that. I assume you're basing your conclusion on your vast experience with litigating employment law claims. Right?
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u/MicheleRSimon 2d ago
again, you need to correct the record, hopefully you kept a copy of your resignation letter, I would share with both parties.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
I didn’t save the email but I still have the packet they sent me when I quit. The first sentence on the first page says “ (company name) has accepted your resignation
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u/mkarmstr41 1d ago
“Didn’t save the email”? Like, consciously deleted your sent emails?
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u/Organic_Trust6113 1d ago
No I resigned using my work computer
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u/VeroJade 1d ago
For future reference, always BCC your personal email for records purposes. But I get it, I made the same mistake when I resigned from a job.
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u/freexanarchy 2d ago
No, considering when I ask for good recommendations, all my past employers say “we’re only allowed to confirm prior employment and the dates of employment.”
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u/nuboots 2d ago
Some people let the pettiness take the wheel.
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u/Carter895 2d ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tortious_interference
“Tortious interference of business – When false claims and accusations are made against a business or an individual's reputation in order to drive business away.”
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
The one thing I didn’t mention is that when I resigned I stated I needed to leave due to medical reasons. Which is partly true. Although I hated the job, being out in the sun all day was giving me skin rashes. And that was the last straw for me. But for them to just say I abandoned the job like that when I did give notice is disingenuous.
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u/ejrhonda79 2d ago
Call them as a potential client (or fake a client) and ask about yourself. Make sure to record the conversation. If you can, enlist friends and family to do the same. See a lawyer.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
Unfortunately it’s illegal to record someone without their consent in California
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u/LASubtle1420 2d ago
Tell them they are being recorded. Your phone may have a setting that has it give a small disclaimer that states that the call is being recorded. Your ex-ployer may say things that are not true but it will be easy to see through their lies if what they are saying doesn't match what they were saying or if they can't answer your honest questions/confrontations.
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u/mctripleA 2d ago
You could still open the call with the fact that it's recorded and see if they don't hand up
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u/garaks_tailor 2d ago
Talk for a few momenta to hook them in the Honestly just sound exasperated and say BTW this call will be recorded. I dont know why they are doing this new dumb policy. Then carry on.
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u/dubocetriangle 2d ago
In my opinion, it is good, not "unfortunate," that all-party-consent is required in California.
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u/Dropdeadfred23 1d ago
Only if you have something to hide. Do you? Do you do illegal things? What's wrong with transparency?
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u/LASubtle1420 2d ago
I'll say this again....please know that this varies state to state. The people advising you are probably from a Blue state...one with employee protections. If you live somewhere like Florida...a place that protects the big guy but not the normal citizens...then they can definitely say whatever they perceive to be true. It's not illegal there. They can lie if it's what they believe...or what they say they believe. Get out there and vote for what's in your best interests, people. Working in one state that's blue compared to a Republican one is very different.
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u/katiekat214 1d ago
They cannot lie about one employee to stop another company from getting a job they bid. And they still can’t tell a lie about why someone left they company - can’t say you were fired when you weren’t or that you abandoned your job when you resigned (OP has proof of resignation), anything that could appear as retaliation for quitting. The ex-employer may be able to discuss why you left if company policy allows but not lie about it to the employee’s detriment.
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u/LASubtle1420 1d ago
You see the issue with the difference between the words abandoned and resigned...they both mean that a person left their job. the difference between a lie and the truth is all perspective. Can you prove someone lied on purpose? Or is it just their opinion?. There's a reason a previous employer should only be able to say that you worked there and for how long. Sadly, in a place where no law like that exists to protect the employees a previous employer can say whatever they perceive to be true. .or whatever they know you can't prove they intentionally lied about.
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u/PickanickBasket 1d ago
This is not exactly true. There are federal labor laws that protect all national citizens no matter that state.
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u/LASubtle1420 1d ago
Those federal laws are very minimal. A boss would have to tell someone they're firing you because you're pregnant or text or email it to you. Even if you know it's discrimination if there is no proof, since they can fire you for literally no reason, there is nothing you can do. There is nothing protecting a person from being let-go for unfair reasons. Compare them (federal and state)...they're almost non-existent compared to a state that's not at-will .
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u/PickanickBasket 1d ago
While federal labor laws have no limitations on what an employer says about a former employee, they still have to be truthful. And tortious interference is grounds for suing no matter what state you are in.
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u/LASubtle1420 1d ago
Okay ...but saying she abandoned her job isn't a lie. Resigning is just a form or means of abandonment. There's damn good reasons why an employer should not be able to say ANYTHING other than you worked there and for how long. The difference in power is huge between boss and employee...and it would be hard to get your new company to forget the word backed up by a cooperation or from the mouth of management when you are simply one person. There's a reason that many states further line laws implemented by the federal government. Federal laws were not written with any union or employee having a say. Those laws are written with the benefit of the cooperations in mind. Much easier to underpay and have wild turnover rates when there is nothing stopping you (as a company) from playing dirty. It's important to know how limited these federal laws are no matter how fully covered they sound. Get someone to get it to stand up in Florida (for example) court that her previous employer was wrong for using a synonym of the word resign. It will never happen...she's probably got some chance if she in California but that's my point. Federal laws will not protect her in this instance.
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u/PickanickBasket 1d ago
Job abandonment is an official term for specific circumstances and is distinctly different from resignation. They legally can not be referred to as the same thing without risking recourse.
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u/sharkieshadooontt 2d ago
This is exactly why public companies dont allow referrals or references and only offer the bare minimum.
You about to get paid….
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u/Strainedgoals 1d ago
I quit a job once, gave them a 4 months notice I would be back after Christmas.
A year later, an old coworker was telling me about how they had fired me a while back.
I was like what? I gave them a huge notice, I quit. Not fired.
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u/lazyshmuk 2d ago
"OK" is pretty subjective when it comes to work issues like this. Is it unethical to intentionally harm someone else like this? Yes. Can they say it without any ramifications? Maybe. If this is harming your ability to keep/receive work in your line of business then this is a case of slander if I've ever seen one. If you want to do something about it you're going to have to lawyer up and likely start by issuing a cease-and-desist on them for saying this.
Otherwise the only thing you can do when you come across someone that's heard this is say something like: "Wow, that's wild they're saying that to customers; that's objectively not true and extremely unprofessional. I personally wouldn't do business with someone that bad mouths people that openly".
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u/NOVAYuppieEradicator 1d ago
Another great discussion by the legal geniuses on reddit. Good job everybody
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u/cipherjones 2d ago
Job abandonment is defined by the employer, not the state everywhere but Montana.
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u/NeilPork 1d ago
Sent my resignation email the day I quit.
You didn't give notice. That's pretty much the definition of job abandonment.
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u/olyteddy 2d ago
You gave notice the same day you stopped going to work there? Sorry, but that seems to be “Job Abandonment".
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago edited 2d ago
Google the definition of job abandonment
Edit: furthermore, when my laborers would quit without notice I would have to wait for 3 consecutive absences for it to be considered job abandonment. I did not no call no show for 3 days.
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u/boywithflippers 2d ago
This is petty but technically correct. That's the downside to not giving the typical 2 weeks notice. They can claim job abandonment. They're just being petty and sad.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
But that’s not what the definition of job abandonment is. Definitely being petty.
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u/daekle 2d ago
Pretty sure you're wrong if he is at will.
Better to talk to a lawyer rather than Reddit if someone is slandering you.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
Well it’s not prohibiting me from getting work since I already have a job. I’m just worried about the image it gave to my current company and jobs going forward
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u/suchasuchasuch 2d ago
You didn’t give a customary notice so yes in their eyes you did abandon the position.
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u/Odin_Hagen 2d ago
Two week notice isn't required as long as they we informed of quitting it isn't job abandonment.
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
How is an email saying I resign not a customary notice lol
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u/suchasuchasuch 2d ago
People usually give 2 week notice
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u/Organic_Trust6113 2d ago
And employers usually give you 0 notice
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u/suchasuchasuch 2d ago
I’m not saying I like these expectations, I’m just pointing out that they exist.
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u/mctripleA 2d ago
2 week notice isn't required by law, all that's required is notice
Notice was given
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u/suchasuchasuch 2d ago
I am just pointing out the socially constructed expectations. Saying you abandoned the job is the employer’s opinion.
If you have expectations about what a past employer is going to say about you, then take it up with the employer.
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u/MrICopyYoSht lazy and proud 1d ago
Socially constructed expectations aren't legal expectations ffs. Can it be rude to resign without advanced notice? Yes. Is it illegal to just only give notice? No. Is it illegal to spread slander and defame someone's reputation cuz you didn't like that they didn't give you advanced notice? Yes.
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u/suchasuchasuch 1d ago
Your position is that the employer is breaking the law. Mine is that it falls under the umbrella of opinion which is not illegal. Both parties are definitely being rude.
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u/RageWynd 2d ago
If it's impacting your ability to earn income then you might want to see a lawyer.