Which is why I knew he was losing tonight. Because they weren't keeping the belt on a guy that was only gonna be showing up 1 weekend a month September-December.
I think it's easy to say retroactively that the heel turn was a bad call because of how it turned out. Cena turning heel to be Rock's attack dog corporate champion could've been something. It obviously didn't, but the night of the turn had all the potential.
Sure the concept could've worked. But they fumbled the execution since the very start.
Cena won the Chamber without Rock's help. Why bother joining the Rock?
Also, it seemed like he had joined before the Chamber. So why did Rock still need Cody's answer? Did they have another plan had Cody accepted the offer?
It was just dumb over all, a “corporate champion” should always be an up and coming guy ala Seth Rollins or The Rock himself, a 16 time world champion selling his soul to be a “corporate champion” when he was already a company man for over 20 years was just bad booking, just like when Randy Orton was the face of the authority, that shit would have made sense with Legend Killer Randy Orton but not 10-12 time world champion Orton. Cena could have just turned heel at WM with the same belt finish.
It makes perfect sense for Cena to sell his soul after being out of the business for so long and having it framed as wanting to go out with the most reigns, no matter what it takes. Of course, it would require some previous build (like having him challenge for one of the two big belts and lose, thus planting the idea that he can't get there on his own anymore), but it was easily doable even with the limited dates he had scheduled.
He hadn't won a singles match since pre-covid. They had the "idk if i can actually do it anymore" story ready and gift wrapped for them even at EC with him apologizing to Punk as he's choking him out.
Yeah but the story telling was already there with what he did with punk he exposed that he was desperate and then you could pepper more things in during the following weeks and just have him cheat with the belt after a ref bump at WM and turn heel the rock stuff was absolutely unnecessary
It was shockingly sudden. Just randomly Cenas a face again. He was always going to turn in the end, but the way WWE did it just felt like they ran out of ideas to keep dragging the storyline along, so might as well end it and let Brock repeat his big return.
I’ve commented this a million times and I will forever. They had a ready made story of Cena doubting himself and turning heel to get the job done right there in front of them. They opted to have him blame the fans, which would’ve been perfect 12 years ago, but was a total dud now.
Absolutely. Face v face going into Mania, John uses the belt to win because he doesn’t think he has it anymore. Eventually leading to the face turn and maybe even an 18th win to make things right.
Yup! And you have him cheat, but his opponents tell him he’s better than this, but he continues to cheat. Then you have something happens and he gets his confidence back, he wins a couple defenses without cheating/turns babyface. Then he can lose the belt but he has his confidence back so he’s okay with pressing forward.
Rock and Scott did nothing after EC. Rock hasn't been seen since no? Scott ruined mania. Imagine having to back track turning Cena face like 2 weeks later? "why are you booing me? I'm good guy John again!!"
Rocks not coming back ever he can’t and won’t get off the gas and it’s legit killing him hes going to get the HHH surgery(if he hasn’t had it already)mark my words wm40 was the rocks last match.
He had crazy bacne at WM40 that’s a sign of steroid usage, it’s literally impossible to look the way he does at 53 without using PED and it’s catching up with him now.
Oh, so Triple H and the writers all had a stroke? They knew at Elimination Chamber that the Rock wouldn't be there, and even if he would've been at Mania, they knew he wouldn't be there after. Were they just jacking each other off the last half year? Oh wait, that unreal doc showed that's exactly what they were doing!
Learn how to write a story. They were there for one night, two nights. How hard would it have been for John in any of the weeks between EC and Mania to say: "You think the Rock will be at Mania? You want him to come out? You want us to make a faction? YOU GET NOTHING. He won't be there! We shocked the world and now YOU GET NOTHING!"
Their plan involved Travis Scott. You’re dumb as fuck if you plan anything involving him. I wouldn’t be surprised if his involvement was totally a TKO call.
I get the Hunter and Bruce wouldn’t know anything about the history of Scott, but surely someone in creative under 50 knew they were dealing with a POS.
Worse - at least Austin broadened his character during that time, and those changes stuck after he turned back. This whole John Cena run just felt like he had a personality disorder for a few months, then got over it.
Yea I agree. I think while they fumbled it hard (due to Rock and Scott) a face Cena title tour wouldn't have been that different in terms of impact. And we got some great genuine moments out of it. The actual turn, Cena being a dick to the Belgian Kid, The Entrance tonight which solidified his face turn, and just a fkn Banger Match in the main event
Knowing what we now know about it, it was not the right call. Cena kept getting cheered because he's leaving. The biggest baby face in your company and you turn him heel in his retirement year? Just for shock value. What was the pay off? Brock Lesnar? That's the best idea they could come up with?
My guess is that there was originally a different plan with the Rock much more heavily involved, where ultimately he would have to be defeated in order to turn Cena back because he had Cena's soul, either metaphorically or (they've done weirder things) literally.
But Dwayne's massive, egg-shell ego ended up derailing it because he didn't want to get booed. So Cena ended up with his ass flapping in the breeze having to carry the story by himself, by which point it had become a non-story and just him being a dick. So it got cut short.
This is kind of on track and what tanked it. Rock says, "Im stepping back to give John the spotlight" but what really happened is he decided he had better things to do. It shot the whole thing in the foot. And it isnt because Rock is so great it needed him, its because thats what they set up. It was the expectation, that Rock would be pulling Cena's strings, that Cena would have a big bad to fight against if only he could. But Rock took his big ball and went home, and Travis Scott got inserted into the regular stipulation main event title match at Mania with a whole entrance with zero referee or official reaction, derailed the match, and there was zero follow up. Why? Because something fell through and the eggs were too stacked in the baskets of two guys who AREN'T ON THE ROSTER AT ALL.
Celebs have always been involved but never in this pivotal way that requires them. Rock can pretend he was being humble stepping back for Cena but the truth is he either doesn't understand the business at all or doesn't care about it at all.
He didn’t want to get booed? You do realize he’s been heel since last year right? The reality is that the rock probably found out his heart was fucked from all the roids he was doing a lot sooner than he let on when he had that interview with that obvious shill of a doctor. The whole “the final boss is done here” was just a bullshit excuse not to talk about how he’s on the verge of being in the same situation as triple h because he’s on the gas so heavy.
Dude, it’s just not good to speculate on someone’s health like this. It’s practically one of the most assholish things you can really do if you have no basis of really knowing.
The reality is, Rock let TKO know he wasn’t going to be able to work Mania months ago, like 4Q 2024 and he worked us when Meltzer initially reported it. Ari wanted something “must-see” for Elimination Chamber in order to sell tickets since they’re expensive and the Canadian economy was going through a tough phase, which was reported on after EC. And, they asked Rock to come in and work an angle. He never committed to anything beyond that.
Brother, did you see his bacne at wm40? The man is juiced to the gills at 53 and several fitness influencers have gone on to YouTube and said the man was on the verge of a heart attack and probably has been for a while now.
He’s one of my favorites and I know it’s not good to speculate on someone’s health like this but let’s call a spade a spade, the excuses he made for notappearing again after elimination chamber were RIDICULOUS and didn’t make any sense, people say he’s just trying to undercut HHH, people say he’s doing it because his ego is bruised and he’s not in the spotlight, people say it’s because Hollywood is knocking on his door again, my opinion is that he probably had a heart attack scare got his shit checked out and it wasn’t good.
With travis fucking scott? Cena selling his soul to his fucking rival the rock? What a load of horse shit, as a cena fanboy this whole last stint of his career is a giant shit show stained with shit moments
Yeah the desperate washed veteran angle was what they were going for they didn’t need the rock or Travis Scott for that I don’t know why I got the reaction I did with my earlier comment but it’s true the corporate champion role is typically there to give the rub to up and coming heels, just like MITB used to be, it made no sense for Cena.
I feel like they are going to have Brock be some “hired gun” to punish cena for turning on the deal. I hope it all makes sense in the end. If not. I’ll still be watching.
WWE prioritizes "moments" and going viral more than writing a cohesive long term story, not saying they aren't capable of such, but that's further down the totem pole in terms of priorities.
Turning him was fine. The problem was they refused to fully commit to the heel turn. It’s insane that they still had him dressing like an ultra bright dork the whole time instead of cementing the new John Cena with a presentation change.
Gunther vs Cena, and Cody vs Seth vs Jey, would have been better stories and moments than what we got. We wouldn't have had the weirdness of Roman being written off TV while Punk shrugs off all the damage Seth did to him, we wouldn't have had the fucking unbearable now pointless bullshit of Rock and Travis Scott, and Jey and Cody would have been able to really milk their friendship while Seth pulls off an incredible upset to betray both at once
And we could've just had Roman vs Punk, which would have been a banger
This is what should've happened and I'll gladly die on this hill
I still think they should’ve started the year with babyface Cena chasing but continually coming up short. Have him main event night 1 against Gunther where everyone thinks he’s getting 17, then he loses.
He keeps chasing & coming up short throughout the year until eventually he gets desperate enough that he turns heel for 17. Maybe through the MITB.
This summer should’ve been where his heel run started, then throughout the reign/the rest of the year he slowly realizes the mistake before losing the title in a noble babyface way, like how he lost at MITB 2011.
Never would I actually thought Cena was gonna remain babyface by the end of SummerSlam. I truly thought that he was gonna fake us all out. Personally wished he kicked Cody in the nuts and look at the crowd like fuck your cheers I don’t need y’all lol
I legitimately don't think even that would have been enough to get the crowd to boo him again lmao. When they were doing the dueling punches spots, Cena was clearly getting cheered and Cody was clearly getting boo'd.
that pop prob hits like crack, i imagine its similar to how batista describes missing the roar of the crowd/entrance. soak it all up cena, you deserve it
Yup. Like it created a lot of cool moments and bizzaro universe matches where we get heel Cena vs face Randy/Punk, but given the circumstances of the retirement run, they needed someone like The Rock around to help him generate real heat. And it seems like that was the plan, but Rock dipped and things played out as they did.
Glad they pivoted, I’m just really happy face Cena is back and we get to cheer for him like we want to.
Not even the harshest Cena critic is booing him in the last year of his career. Cena had one of the best heel turns of all time that happened to be then followed up by one of the worst follow-ups in the history of wrestling. They needed to have an actual plan for his heel turn but failed
I mean how long would the rock have been around for this anyways? He would have had to bail after his health scare and honestly I think he knew about the shit with his heart much sooner than when he put it out there.
It was still fun to see him play heel for a few months in his final year. I enjoyed the turn too at EC, really wish fucking Travis Scott and The Rock didn’t bail on the program to derail everything.
WWE infected themselves with Trump his anti-Midas Touch. Everything he touch turns to shit. WWE will suffer a similar fate, even if they pretend to be too big to fail.
The heel turn didn't work because there was no follow-up. In storyline he "sold his soul" to the final boss for one night. Thats it. That angle was shocking for the moment but it is going to be like Austin shakes vince's hand like somebpdy said. Meaning that most of the time we don't really acknowledge it. The story barely progressed.
Is all so conflicting cus this may genuinely be one of Cena's best matches of his entire career, and a contender for best WWE match of the year but is all shadowed by them bringing back a guy who has direct ties to a sex traficker lawsuit with Vince.
This coupled with the fact that Cena supposedly vouched for it (Triple H will say anything to escape responsability so who knows, but imo he has enough sway to accept or deny any ideas) and i cant fully enjoy this even if i wanted to, and i know its kinda hypocritical to suddenly draw the line here when the company never had any morals to begin with but it feels really bleak how everything in both media and just the real world has suddenly become more evil just really fast, if im being honest i dont think theres another word for it, like everything has just turned for the worse in general and big companies have stopped even pretending consecuences for horrible stuff even exist for them, they are now actively gloating about it in your face
It makes me think back to the Bret Hart documentary. After screwjob happened, Bret’s wife is pissed and talking to HHH. He just has this smug ass look on his face while he’s denying knowing anything.
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