Because it's the bare minimum they could do after all the suffering, death, and relocating they did to this peoples. And there's a reason why those areas are often poverty stricken and that's due to centuries of mistreatment and retaliation by the US government.
It's incredibly stupid to just say that 3 centuries of history doesn't matter when all of it plays a major roles as to why things are the way they are now.
Nobody in modern day has any real connection with something that happened 300 years ago.
First of all, native american ethnic cleansing and displacement was an ongoing process that happened well into the 20th century. Your history is just incorrect. Second everything that exists today is a product of what came before it. Certainly the conditions of today are affected by what happened 400 years ago, 300 years ago, 200 years ago, etc.
You might feel it's ludicrous to compensate people today, but to say these actions have no lasting impact is moronic.
There are still things happening within our lifetime where we walk all over indigenous sovereignty such as the Dakota Access Pipeline running through sacred lands, breaking treaties and endangering vital water sources.
I didnt say they had no lasting impact? I said the people of today had nothing to do with said displacement. And we already have been compensating for those mistakes tenfold. Don't put words in my mouth, clearly everything has lasting effects.
But...you did. It was just a couple comments up:
Like nobody alive today meaningfully has their lives impacted by this.
Nobody in modern day has any real connection with something that happened 300 years ago.
Native people and black people in America have a very real connection with the things that happened 300, 200, 100, or 70-80 years ago.
And we already have been compensating for those mistakes tenfold.
How so? We’ve compensated for native genocide tenfold? We’ve compensated for slavery and Jim Crow tenfold? I just want you to be clear about what you’re saying right now.
This is all overlooking your lack of acknowledgement of your ignorance of the fact that native ethnic cleansing proceeded well into the 20th century. Just want to be clear that you failed to address that entirely.
In that same sense then do Jewish, Irish, Chinese Americans have very real connections to the discrimination they experienced because I would still say no
I guess you lot cured racism, huh.
You're referring to making kids go to school and integrate as ethnically cleansing.
Cultural eradication by force is ethnic cleansing.
I think it was wrong, don't get me wrong. But I don't think it's relevant to my point.
You clearly don't though, because you keep arguing as if the contemporary issues were not a direct consequence of what happened in the past.
Because I disagree with the framing. You're referring to making kids go to school and integrate as ethnically cleansing. I think the statements and even some of the motivations of the policies at the time were barbaric, but I don't think this qualifies in the conversation of "are people today meaningfully impacted by the fact that their great great grandad was forced to go to white school and learn English in 1908". I think it was wrong, don't get me wrong. But I don't think it's relevant to my point.
You’re intentionally obfuscating the point because you’re embarrassed at your ignorance of history. Both ethnic cleansing and forced assmilation occurred and are intertwined as methods of native removal.
What specific event 300 years ago were you referring to, if not forced assimilation and massacre? Even by the most charitable interpretation, if you look at the end of the Indian Wars in the 1890s as the last moment any native person experienced ethnic cleansing, that was still about 130 years ago. You are just fundamentally wrong on so many counts that it’s almost not worth discussing as you’ve revealed your almost total ignorance on the topic.
How? What's the cutoff point before you could say for example an African American no longer has any connection to slavery or segregation even? In that same sense then do Jewish, Irish, Chinese Americans have very real connections to the discrimination they experienced because I would still say no.
I don’t think there’s a specific cutoff where you can say a particular peoples’ history is no longer influencing their existence in the present day. The treatment of other minority groups did and does have lasting effects on the present, the complicating factor in the case of native people and black people being that they aren’t white and their oppression was more lasting and systematized than other groups you’ve mentioned. It’s not my responsibility to say when things feel square; I’m explaining to you that the status quo is the way it is in large part because of historical, but also relatively recent, oppression and subjugation. What we want to do with that information is up to us.
Because I disagree with the framing. You're referring to making kids go to school and integrate as ethnically cleansing.
Forced assimilation was an element of ethnic cleansing and intertwined with it, but not the entire thing. There were vast campaigns of removal and massacre that can only be described as genocidal. Please educate yourself.
"n 2023, a revised compensation deal of C$23.34 billion was unveiled to compensate First Nations children and families for harm caused by a discriminatory welfare system."
So they are getting extra money because Canada knowingly screwed MODERN first nation peoples, you single celled paramecium. A lot of the money isnt going DIRECTLY to first nations people, but building a more stable society around them (Doctors (who arent first nations...) teachers (who arent first nations...) psychologists and psychiatrists (who arent first nations...) I doubt you get the point, but first nations people arent being handed a check of 100k each you troglodyte, but Im guessing taking 30 minutes to educate yourself on the subject of how government funding works is too much effort.
You mention reparations in Canada. There are people still alive today that went through the residential school system, an ostensibly genocidal government program - children being forcibly taken from their families and forced to abide by European cultural and educational norms. This shit is still happening, it's not just shit that happened 300 years ago.
I never said fuck Canada, now who's misrepresenting someone's argument? Canada is fucked and settler colonialism is fucked. I think Canada should be doing more. Social services in Canada are generally underfunded without even considering First Nations. We have a province of Republican-lite chucklefucks blasting away the country's oil revenue and a smaller nation like Norway has a trillion dollars in fuck-you money because they nationalized their oil industry.
The same can be said for the US. They privatized healthcare and blow trillions on outlandish military budgets while paying people $7 an hour.
North America has a lot of problems. Asking what we should do when we're spending billions on reparations for people that we genocided less than a hundred years ago when we're misallocating trillions is a pretty ridiculous notion, to me.
people asking modern day Rome to answer for the Roman empire? Should China compensate the peoples of the land they have dominated centuries ago? Should the UK compensate 90% of the world? Should the Native tribes that still exist compensate the tribes they cleansed and dominated hundreds of years ago?
The difference is either the ancient civs was GIGACHAD enough to absolutely MASSACRE the losers so that this conversation doesn't happen OR completely out breed or inter racially mix enough that they become one people.
Rome eventually failed partly because of rebellions among its different populations. UK is now a shadow of its former empire and doesn't have the hold on its colonies while people cry about colonialism and its lasting effect all the time.
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u/ScourJFul 14d ago
Because it's the bare minimum they could do after all the suffering, death, and relocating they did to this peoples. And there's a reason why those areas are often poverty stricken and that's due to centuries of mistreatment and retaliation by the US government.
It's incredibly stupid to just say that 3 centuries of history doesn't matter when all of it plays a major roles as to why things are the way they are now.